Sex and gender

[Immanuel Can]

I don't know what they want me to believe, because I haven't gone out of my way to find out; I only know what you are trying to get me to believe.

I'm not trying to get you to believe anything. I'm trying to get you merely to see what they are saying to you, and how absurd it is. You said you didn't understand: now you do, if you want to. And if you don't, I can't force you to.

Service provided: if it's not accepted, that's up to you.

You take the most outspoken, militant ones from the bunch and try to present them as being representative of all the rest.

Nope. Feel free to check. What I'm telling you they say is exactly what they do, in fact, say. There just isn't a rational justification for transgenderism. It's self-contradicting, every time.

[vegetariantaxidermy]

I don't know what they want me to believe, because I haven't gone out of my way to find out; I only know what you are trying to get me to believe.

I'm not trying to get you to believe anything. I'm trying to get you merely to see what they are saying to you, and how absurd it is. You said you didn't understand: now you do, if you want to. And if you don't, I can't force you to.

Service provided: if it's not accepted, that's up to you.

You take the most outspoken, militant ones from the bunch and try to present them as being representative of all the rest. If, as a group or class, these people are making unreasonable demands, then of course they should be refused, but you are condemning them for what they are, not just for what they might be asking for. You are making a moral judgement based on your own distaste, and dressing it up as some sort of social concern.

It's the 'militant' ones who are the problem. Same with anything. 'Squeaky wheel syndrome'. This doesn't even affect you so why do you keep commenting on it? If you aren't going to stand up for women then fuck off because it has nothing to do with you.

[Harbal]

I'm not trying to get you to believe anything. I'm trying to get you merely to see what they are saying to you, and how absurd it is. You said you didn't understand: now you do, if you want to. And if you don't, I can't force you to.

Service provided: if it's not accepted, that's up to you.

You take the most outspoken, militant ones from the bunch and try to present them as being representative of all the rest.

Nope. Feel free to check. What I'm telling you they say is exactly what they do, in fact, say. There just isn't a rational justification for transgenderism. It's self-contradicting, every time.

So do you think personal lifestyle choices should only be allowed when they can be justified to you on rational grounds? I think you are going to upset a lot of train spotters, bird watchers and stamp collectors.

[Harbal]

If you aren't going to stand up for women then fuck off because it has nothing to do with you.

And what has my conversation with IC got to do with you?

[vegetariantaxidermy]

You take the most outspoken, militant ones from the bunch and try to present them as being representative of all the rest.

Nope. Feel free to check. What I'm telling you they say is exactly what they do, in fact, say. There just isn't a rational justification for transgenderism. It's self-contradicting, every time.

So do you think personal lifestyle choices should only be allowed when they can be justified to you on rational grounds? I think you are going to upset a lot of train spotters, bird watchers and stamp collectors.

Why have you ignored every point I've made on this, hairball? That's not a good way to conduct an 'argument'. Why do you think 'transwomen' shouldn't be allowed in women's toilets and changing rooms?

[vegetariantaxidermy]

If you aren't going to stand up for women then fuck off because it has nothing to do with you.

And what has my conversation with IC got to do with you?

And what does women's rights have to do with you?

[Harbal]

Nope. Feel free to check. What I'm telling you they say is exactly what they do, in fact, say. There just isn't a rational justification for transgenderism. It's self-contradicting, every time.

So do you think personal lifestyle choices should only be allowed when they can be justified to you on rational grounds? I think you are going to upset a lot of train spotters, bird watchers and stamp collectors.

Why have you ignored every point I've made on this, hairball? That's not a good way to conduct an 'argument'. Why do you think 'transwomen' shouldn't be allowed in women's toilets and changing rooms?

I'm sorry, but we agreed we had nothing to discuss.

[vegetariantaxidermy]

So do you think personal lifestyle choices should only be allowed when they can be justified to you on rational grounds? I think you are going to upset a lot of train spotters, bird watchers and stamp collectors.

Why have you ignored every point I've made on this, hairball? That's not a good way to conduct an 'argument'. Why do you think 'transwomen' shouldn't be allowed in women's toilets and changing rooms?

I'm sorry, but we agreed we had nothing to discuss.

Why do you think 'transwomen' shouldn't be allowed in women's sports, toilets and changing rooms? Surely you can answer that?

[Immanuel Can]

You take the most outspoken, militant ones from the bunch and try to present them as being representative of all the rest.

Nope. Feel free to check. What I'm telling you they say is exactly what they do, in fact, say. There just isn't a rational justification for transgenderism. It's self-contradicting, every time.

So do you think personal lifestyle choices should only be allowed when they can be justified to you on rational grounds?

There is no "choice" of a man becoming a woman. There's no "choice" of a man becoming a pumpkin, either.

But there is a choice to become a bird watcher or stamp collector, and anybody can do those.

Vive la difference.

[Harbal]

Why have you ignored every point I've made on this, hairball? That's not a good way to conduct an 'argument'. Why do you think 'transwomen' shouldn't be allowed in women's toilets and changing rooms?

I'm sorry, but we agreed we had nothing to discuss.

Why do you think 'transwomen' shouldn't be allowed in women's sports,

The reasons are obvious. Male bodies and female bodies are different in size and strength, giving men an unfair advantage. It would defeat the object of separating male and female sport in the first place.

toilets and changing rooms?

The fact that women object to it is reason enough.

[Harbal]

Nope. Feel free to check. What I'm telling you they say is exactly what they do, in fact, say. There just isn't a rational justification for transgenderism. It's self-contradicting, every time.

So do you think personal lifestyle choices should only be allowed when they can be justified to you on rational grounds?

There is no "choice" of a man becoming a woman. There's no "choice" of a man becoming a pumpkin, either.

But there is a choice to become a bird watcher or stamp collector, and anybody can do those.

Vive la difference.

They can't be women, but if they want to live their lives as if they were women that's a choice they are able to make. I have no problem with that choice except when it infringes anybody else's rights.

[Immanuel Can]

So do you think personal lifestyle choices should only be allowed when they can be justified to you on rational grounds?

There is no "choice" of a man becoming a woman. There's no "choice" of a man becoming a pumpkin, either.

But there is a choice to become a bird watcher or stamp collector, and anybody can do those.

Vive la difference.

They can't be women, but if they want to live their lives as if they were women that's a choice they are able to make.

That's a different question. I may be free to live as whatever I imagine a pumpkin to be, but I'm not free to BE a pumpkin; and therefore, nobody owes me any consideration on the basis of my claimed "pumpkintude," including calling me by my preferred pronouns, "pie" and "muffin."

[Harbal]

There is no "choice" of a man becoming a woman. There's no "choice" of a man becoming a pumpkin, either.

But there is a choice to become a bird watcher or stamp collector, and anybody can do those.

Vive la difference.

They can't be women, but if they want to live their lives as if they were women that's a choice they are able to make.

That's a different question. I may be free to live as whatever I imagine a pumpkin to be, but I'm not free to BE a pumpkin; and therefore, nobody owes me any consideration on the basis of my claimed "pumpkintude," including calling me by my preferred pronouns, "pie" and "muffin."

Neither do you owe them condemnation for not conforming to "normality", yet you are prepared to give that quite freely. Just like a true Christian.

[Immanuel Can]

They can't be women, but if they want to live their lives as if they were women that's a choice they are able to make.

That's a different question. I may be free to live as whatever I imagine a pumpkin to be, but I'm not free to BE a pumpkin; and therefore, nobody owes me any consideration on the basis of my claimed "pumpkintude," including calling me by my preferred pronouns, "pie" and "muffin."

Neither do you owe them condemnation for not conforming to "normality", yet you are prepared to give that quite freely.

You'll have to point out to me how I "condemned" them. All I said was that what they were claiming was totally irrational and impossible. And it is. And, in fact, you can check for yourself, and you'll find that it is.

[vegetariantaxidermy]

I'm sorry, but we agreed we had nothing to discuss.

Why do you think 'transwomen' shouldn't be allowed in women's sports,

The reasons are obvious. Male bodies and female bodies are different in size and strength, giving men an unfair advantage. It would defeat the object of separating male and female sport in the first place.

toilets and changing rooms?

The fact that women object to it is reason enough.

Then what are you arguing about? If people can legally 'choose their sex' and have 'male'' on their birth certificate changed to 'female' then what's to prevent them from doing everything women do? And this is all because of one word: 'gender'.
You have some nasty little misogynist over there called 'India' Willoughby who insists that he's a 'biological woman' (and the testosterone really kicks in if he sniffs even a whiff of disagreement). He likes to caress his fake breasts in front of women (I don't know a single woman who would even think of doing that).
Frankly I don't see any way out of this mess. Women will simply have to stop using public toilets or competing in women's sports. Not sure what they will do about the prison thing though, or women's refuges etc.
It's all pure misogyny from beginning to end. Men are delighted of course. It was about time 'those bitches' got their come-uppance.

Here's another delight. You do seem to breed them over there. 'Freda Wallace'. You might even catch a glimpse of his lady testicles. At one point Tatchell ordered him to stop drinking (which was immediately ignored) but that may have been cut from this.

Tatchell and 'Freda' have no argument either, they are both incoherent, so don't feel bad that you don't have one.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Va3i-_F ... micAffairs