Why I Don't Accept the Axioms of Math
Why I Don't Accept the Axioms of Math
The fact that mathematical axioms are 'self' evidential necessitates a self within the formation of mathematics and as such further necessitates a subjectivity. This subjective nature to math paradoxically results in certain axioms not being accepted as the subjective is relative thus necessitating true/false values for everything depending upon the angle of observation. I don't accept the axioms of math and the 'self'-evidential nature of these axioms is further proof I don't have to.
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Re: Why I Don't Accept the Axioms of Math
This level of disagreement requires a PhD.
Re: Why I Don't Accept the Axioms of Math
There is no "factual" basis for counting/addition and the subsequent CREATION of "quantity." 1+1=2 is a belief, an assumption, that has been accepted as fact.Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Fri Mar 10, 2023 9:18 pm The fact that mathematical axioms are 'self' evidential necessitates a self within the formation of mathematics and as such further necessitates a subjectivity. This subjective nature to math paradoxically results in certain axioms not being accepted as the subjective is relative thus necessitating true/false values for everything depending upon the angle of observation. I don't accept the axioms of math and the 'self'-evidential nature of these axioms is further proof I don't have to.
The Principia Mathematica 360 page "proof" is obviously not a discovery of a fundamental phenomenon, but a programming of human consciousness into believing that 1+1=2. Occam's razor cuts those 360 pages down to a single sentence: "One plus one equals two because every single last one of us believes that it does."
Re: Why I Don't Accept the Axioms of Math
That's idiotic. You are confusing the formalisation/codification/representation with what it represents. You understand the concept of representation. Yes?
You have an apple in your left hand and an apple in your right hand. How many apples do you have? We represent/encode the situation as "1+1=2".
Thereafter we attempt to find axioms (foundations!) from which the statement 1+1=2 can be deduced. It's a backwards process.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reverse_mathematics
Here's an egg:roydop wrote: ↑Wed Mar 15, 2023 2:19 am The Principia Mathematica 360 page "proof" is obviously not a discovery of a fundamental phenomenon, but a programming of human consciousness into believing that 1+1=2. Occam's razor cuts those 360 pages down to a single sentence: "One plus one equals two because every single last one of us believes that it does."
Here is another egg:
Do you deny that there are two eggs on your screen?
- Agent Smith
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Re: Why I Don't Accept the Axioms of Math
1 is problematic.
Despite that I'm in agreement with the gist of the OP.
Despite that I'm in agreement with the gist of the OP.
Re: Why I Don't Accept the Axioms of Math
OK. You reject the axioms (premises), but do you accept any of the theorems (conclusions) ?Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Fri Mar 10, 2023 9:18 pm The fact that mathematical axioms are 'self' evidential necessitates a self within the formation of mathematics and as such further necessitates a subjectivity. This subjective nature to math paradoxically results in certain axioms not being accepted as the subjective is relative thus necessitating true/false values for everything depending upon the angle of observation. I don't accept the axioms of math and the 'self'-evidential nature of these axioms is further proof I don't have to.
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Re: Why I Don't Accept the Axioms of Math
What does you not accepting them entail?Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Fri Mar 10, 2023 9:18 pm The fact that mathematical axioms are 'self' evidential necessitates a self within the formation of mathematics and as such further necessitates a subjectivity. This subjective nature to math paradoxically results in certain axioms not being accepted as the subjective is relative thus necessitating true/false values for everything depending upon the angle of observation. I don't accept the axioms of math and the 'self'-evidential nature of these axioms is further proof I don't have to.
Do you not use math when shopping? You don't count things?
Do you avoid technology based on math?
Do you not check the change you receive from stores?
How does this not accepting the axioms of math affect anything?
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Re: Why I Don't Accept the Axioms of Math
He's using this forum, so I think that's a no.
The post counter at the bottom of this page went from 7 to 8 after I pressed submit.
I don't even think it would be possible to get by in life without some basic mathematical assumptions. I could be wrong about that, but it would seem to make things very difficult. I mean if someone asks you for 50 cents for a pack of gum, you pull a quarter out of your pocket and suddenly you have no clue how many more quarters you need for 50 cents.
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Re: Why I Don't Accept the Axioms of Math
Yes, I was being snotty, and then also asking a real question.
I don't think it's necessarily hypocritical to use math but not accept (in some sense) the axioms.
I thought it was an interesting formulation: I don't accept....
So, I'm probing.
Random!The post counter at the bottom of this page went from 7 to 8 after I pressed submit.
.Nor a whole mass of other assumptions. Sometimes in philosophy forums people can come across as if they think they never use intuition nor make assumptions. Everything they believe is based on empirical research and deduction. Good luck surviving for a week or managing to, without breaking one's own rules, argue anything.I don't even think it would be possible to get by in life without some basic mathematical assumptions
And a teacher loses their job on the first field trip.I could be wrong about that, but it would seem to make things very difficult. I mean if someone asks you for 50 cents for a pack of gum, you pull a quarter out of your pocket and suddenly you have no clue how many more quarters you need for 50 cents.
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Re: Why I Don't Accept the Axioms of Math
I didn't know math had axioms. This just doesn't make any sense. How can the cat have eaten the cheese?
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Re: Why I Don't Accept the Axioms of Math
You must have noticed them in geometry in school. Even the pedagogically challenged teacher can't avoid mentioning them.Agent Smith wrote: ↑Wed Mar 15, 2023 11:44 am I didn't know math had axioms. This just doesn't make any sense. How can the cat have eaten the cheese?
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Re: Why I Don't Accept the Axioms of Math
Indeed mon ami, indeed! Geometry, yep, it was geometry! Cheesy cat!Iwannaplato wrote: ↑Wed Mar 15, 2023 1:03 pmYou must have noticed them in geometry in school. Even the pedagogically challenged teacher can't avoid mentioning them.Agent Smith wrote: ↑Wed Mar 15, 2023 11:44 am I didn't know math had axioms. This just doesn't make any sense. How can the cat have eaten the cheese?
Re: Why I Don't Accept the Axioms of Math
You are simply regurgitating what you have been brainwashed to accept.Skepdick wrote: ↑Wed Mar 15, 2023 6:44 amThat's idiotic. You are confusing the formalisation/codification/representation with what it represents. You understand the concept of representation. Yes?
You have an apple in your left hand and an apple in your right hand. How many apples do you have? We represent/encode the situation as "1+1=2".
Thereafter we attempt to find axioms (foundations!) from which the statement 1+1=2 can be deduced. It's a backwards process.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reverse_mathematics
Here's an egg:roydop wrote: ↑Wed Mar 15, 2023 2:19 am The Principia Mathematica 360 page "proof" is obviously not a discovery of a fundamental phenomenon, but a programming of human consciousness into believing that 1+1=2. Occam's razor cuts those 360 pages down to a single sentence: "One plus one equals two because every single last one of us believes that it does."
Here is another egg:
Do you deny that there are two eggs on your screen?
I deny that "quantity" has anything to do with the physical realm.
Re: Why I Don't Accept the Axioms of Math
No, I am not.
I never said it was a physical egg. It's just an emoji.
How many emoji-eggs do you see?
Do you want me to write you a computer program to count them?
irb(main):001:0> %w( ).count
=> 2
Re: Why I Don't Accept the Axioms of Math
I'm relating to something deeper here and you don't want to see it.