How to deal with a friend who thinks COVID 19 is a hoax

[vegetariantaxidermy]

The virus is real because it was planned.Psychological rationalisation has been strategically implemented for the next generation to become biological robotic servants to serve the devil.

Any one with half a brain cell knows what's happening here.

The awakened ones will not fear, for they are already dead and living their best life in love and light.

The evil ones will not know where to point their guns at the dead.

.

Bloody nut job.

[Sculptor]

What do you care? If you choose to swallow the popular view that we're all going to die unless we all wear a half-bra on our face and never hug anyone we love,

Childish exaggeration does not become you. No one is saying that; no one beleives it.

There are some of us who are likely to die were they to become infected - me for one.

Don't become infected!

Duh yeah!

[RCSaunders]

What do you suggest be done about the overflowing hospitals and medical supply shortages because too many people are needing treatment all at once?

Which presumes I have some obligation to even think about a supposed problem that has nothing to do with me.

No it doesn't. You are making presumptions. It was a question about another angle of the situation.[/quote]
Perhaps I did presume. So make it clear to me, if you care to.

Aren't you asking me to suggest a solution to what you regard as a problem? I can only make such a suggestion if I tacitly assume your premise that there is such a problem and that in some way it should matter to me enough to suggest a solution. Is that not right?

[RCSaunders]

What sinister ends this is being done for I guess I'll just have to be ignorant of.

There probably aren't any. Government action is always determined by expediency, whatever will achieve some immediate goal (like getting re-elected) with no thought for long term consequences.

But just in case, you might want to question why you are being asked to wear a mask (or gold star) and why you are being told where you can and can't go (just get on the train and head for the community shower).

[RCSaunders]

The virus is real because it was planned.Psychological rationalisation has been strategically implemented for the next generation to become biological robotic servants to serve the devil.

Any one with half a brain cell knows what's happening here.

The awakened ones will not fear, for they are already dead and living their best life in love and light.

The evil ones will not know where to point their guns at the dead.

Bloody nut job.

Spot on!

You made my morning, thank you.

[Dontaskme]

We were warned in 2012, when the Rand Corporation surveyed the international threats arrayed against the United States and concluded that only pandemics posed an existential danger, in that they were “capable of destroying America’s way of life.”

We were warned in 2015, when Ezra Klein of Vox, after speaking with Bill Gates about his algorithmic model for how a new strain of flu could spread rapidly in today’s globalized world, wrote that “a pandemic disease is the most predictable catastrophe in the history of the human race, if only because it has happened to the human race so many, many times before.” If there was anything humanity could be certain that it needed to prepare for to prevent the deaths of a lot of people in little time, it was this.

We were warned in 2015,2017, 2018, 2019....



Fail to prepare. Prepare to fail.


We Were Warned
When the inevitable inquiry into the government's response to COVID-19 happens, it will conclude that signs of a coming crisis were everywhere.




https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/ar ... dc/608215/


.

[Dontaskme]

FAIL TO PLAN ...OR....PLAN TO FAIL

You decide.

Never trust those you trust. The universe doesn’t give a shit about you.

Die before you die , then always speak the truth.

Truth has no followers.

Don’t follow me, for I too am lost.

Wake up fools.

[Lacewing]

Aren't you asking me to suggest a solution to what you regard as a problem? I can only make such a suggestion if I tacitly assume your premise that there is such a problem and that in some way it should matter to me enough to suggest a solution. Is that not right?

I was asking to see if you would comment on another circumstance, or whether you don't believe that exists, or whether you're only going to focus on one angle because that's what suits you.

[RCSaunders]

Aren't you asking me to suggest a solution to what you regard as a problem? I can only make such a suggestion if I tacitly assume your premise that there is such a problem and that in some way it should matter to me enough to suggest a solution. Is that not right?

I was asking to see if you would comment on another circumstance, or whether you don't believe that exists, or whether you're only going to focus on one angle because that's what suits you.

I'm still not sure what you were after. I don't have any recommendations because I think everyone has to make their own judgement and do whatever they think is best for them.

I think the whole thing has been terribly exaggerated and that there is a great deal of unnecessary paranoid fear resulting from that exaggeration. Governments everywhere, national and local, are using that irrational fear to justify imposing restrictions and other mandates on businesses and individuals which will ultimately be enormously more harmful than all the corona virus problems could ever be.

Individuals need to think for themselves and not simply swallow whatever their governments or news sources tell them so they can make their own informed choices. But that is not the poular view. If one does not swallow the whole corona virus panic story and do whatever one else does they are treated as some kind of pariahs. It's very subtle.

I don't mean to pick on Gary Childress, but his innocent sounding question to Henry is exactly what I mean:

And you won't help your fellow human by wearing a mask?

You know what is implied. If you don't do what everyone else thinks is the right way to deal with the corona virus you don't care about your fellow human beings. In the long run, this short-sighted do whatever feels right solution is going to harm a great many human beings more than any corona virus.

[RCSaunders]

So you don't think anyone should follow the CDC guidelines, recommendations or whatever?

again: you can do as you see fit; just as I do everyday


Or are you somehow special?

I'm a Free Man, self-directing & self-responsible.

And you won't help your fellow human by wearing a mask?

I mentioned you here. Just don't want to refer to someone without their knowing.

[Gary Childress]

I don't mean to pick on Gary Childress, but his innocent sounding question to Henry is exactly what I mean:

And you won't help your fellow human by wearing a mask?

You know what is implied. If you don't do what everyone else thinks is the right way to deal with the corona virus you don't care about your fellow human beings. In the long run, this short-sighted do whatever feels right solution is going to harm a great many human beings more than any corona virus.

OK. That's a fair point. But, just to play devil's advocate (I'm no saint by any measure myself) without shaming people, what incentive is there to act virtuously? We often do things because we want to feel good about ourselves for doing them but sometimes we do things because we don't want to feel shame. Sort of the carrot and stick of morality, as it were. Take away the carrot and stick and what promotes morality? Although, I believe you had mentioned that you are "amoral" so perhaps it doesn't really apply in whatever sense to you. I don't know. But I'm curious about the answer from someone who is amoral.

[Sculptor]

I don't mean to pick on Gary Childress, but his innocent sounding question to Henry is exactly what I mean:

And you won't help your fellow human by wearing a mask?

You know what is implied. If you don't do what everyone else thinks is the right way to deal with the corona virus you don't care about your fellow human beings. In the long run, this short-sighted do whatever feels right solution is going to harm a great many human beings more than any corona virus.

OK. That's a fair point. But, just to play devil's advocate (I'm no saint by any measure myself) without shaming people, what incentive is there to act virtuously? We often do things because we want to feel good about ourselves for doing them but sometimes we do things because we don't want to feel shame. Sort of the carrot and stick of morality, as it were. Take away the carrot and stick and what promotes morality? Although, I believe you had mentioned that you are "amoral" so perhaps it doesn't really apply in whatever sense to you. I don't know. But I'm curious about the answer from someone who is amoral.

Virtue requires no incentive. Its about self respect for one thing.

But even for a person who is amoral, taking a few simple precautions is of benefit not only to others but to yourself. Hand washing has general benefit against a massive range of pathogens. If you don't like a face mask, then stay out of shops and buy online. What else is there?

There is a lot of whinging and moaning and whining. Skeptics should STFU and volunteer at a local hospital that is coping with the infection. See for themselves!

[RCSaunders]

I don't mean to pick on Gary Childress, but his innocent sounding question to Henry is exactly what I mean:

And you won't help your fellow human by wearing a mask?

You know what is implied. If you don't do what everyone else thinks is the right way to deal with the corona virus you don't care about your fellow human beings. In the long run, this short-sighted do whatever feels right solution is going to harm a great many human beings more than any corona virus.

OK. That's a fair point. But, just to play devil's advocate (I'm no saint by any measure myself) without shaming people, what incentive is there to act virtuously? We often do things because we want to feel good about ourselves for doing them but sometimes we do things because we don't want to feel shame. Sort of the carrot and stick of morality, as it were. Take away the carrot and stick and what promotes morality? Although, I believe you had mentioned that you are "amoral" so perhaps it doesn't really apply in whatever sense to you. I don't know. But I'm curious about the answer from someone who is amoral.

There is only one reason for virtue, because it is good for you. Being virtuous means being the best human being you can be because anything less cannot possibly make you happy or fulfill the requirements of your nature as a human being.

Virtue is not for the sake of others, it is for your own sake. If you are truly virtuous, if you are all you can be as a human being, you will never be a threat to others and all you do will benefit others, but those are consequences of your virtue, not the reason for them.

If you are truly virtuous it will not matter to you what anyone else thinks of you or believes about you. What you are is not determined by what others think of you, but what you actually choose, do, and know your are.

If you need a carrot, the carrot is the reward of self-confidence and self-esteem you will have in knowing you did your best to achieve and be all you can, to know that all you have and are you have earned and achieved by your own effort, that you are a human being, a rational, volition, intellectual being living as that kind of being, not as a parasite, herd animal, or predator, but a producer and creator who has chosen to be who you are.

If you need a stick, failing to be all you can be, failing to learn all you can and achieve all you can, taking short-cuts or seeking the unearned can only lead to a life of disappointment at best and most likely despair and self-destruction. If you live to the best of your ability in all things, you will have pleasure and joy as your reward, but, if you seek pleasure and joy for their own sake, you will have nothing but shallow meaningless pleasures that ultimately disappoint and disgrace you.

A full answer to the question you asked would require a treatise not possible here. These are some of the fundamentals.

[Gary Childress]

OK. That's a fair point. But, just to play devil's advocate (I'm no saint by any measure myself) without shaming people, what incentive is there to act virtuously? We often do things because we want to feel good about ourselves for doing them but sometimes we do things because we don't want to feel shame. Sort of the carrot and stick of morality, as it were. Take away the carrot and stick and what promotes morality? Although, I believe you had mentioned that you are "amoral" so perhaps it doesn't really apply in whatever sense to you. I don't know. But I'm curious about the answer from someone who is amoral.

Virtue requires no incentive. Its about self respect for one thing.

I don't know. I suppose that's one way to look at it. I believe Aristotle talked about happiness or flourishing as having intrinsic worth and that virtue brings about such a state. So that seems like an incentive to me. Conversely, if someone is wicked, then they pay a price for their lack of virtue through shame or having a bad reputation.

But even for a person who is amoral, taking a few simple precautions is of benefit not only to others but to yourself. Hand washing has general benefit against a massive range of pathogens.

I think wearing a mask is somewhat of an exception, though. Supposedly, masks don't do much to protect the wearer, but rather to protect others to a limited extent from germs from the one wearing it. So it requires a little bit of altruism and cooperation, perhaps, sacrificing comfort (or whatever else it is that urges a person not to wear one) for the sake of others' safety.

[Gary Childress]

I don't mean to pick on Gary Childress, but his innocent sounding question to Henry is exactly what I mean:


You know what is implied. If you don't do what everyone else thinks is the right way to deal with the corona virus you don't care about your fellow human beings. In the long run, this short-sighted do whatever feels right solution is going to harm a great many human beings more than any corona virus.

OK. That's a fair point. But, just to play devil's advocate (I'm no saint by any measure myself) without shaming people, what incentive is there to act virtuously? We often do things because we want to feel good about ourselves for doing them but sometimes we do things because we don't want to feel shame. Sort of the carrot and stick of morality, as it were. Take away the carrot and stick and what promotes morality? Although, I believe you had mentioned that you are "amoral" so perhaps it doesn't really apply in whatever sense to you. I don't know. But I'm curious about the answer from someone who is amoral.

There is only one reason for virtue, because it is good for you. Being virtuous means being the best human being you can be because anything less cannot possibly make you happy or fulfill the requirements of your nature as a human being.

Virtue is not for the sake of others, it is for your own sake. If you are truly virtuous, if you are all you can be as a human being, you will never be a threat to others and all you do will benefit others, but those are consequences of your virtue, not the reason for them.

If you are truly virtuous it will not matter to you what anyone else thinks of you or believes about you. What you are is not determined by what others think of you, but what you actually choose, do, and know your are.

If you need a carrot, the carrot is the reward of self-confidence and self-esteem you will have in knowing you did your best to achieve and be all you can, to know that all you have and are you have earned and achieved by your own effort, that you are a human being, a rational, volition, intellectual being living as that kind of being, not as a parasite, herd animal, or predator, but a producer and creator who has chosen to be who you are.

If you need a stick, failing to be all you can be, failing to learn all you can and achieve all you can, taking short-cuts or seeking the unearned can only lead to a life of disappointment at best and most likely despair and self-destruction. If you live to the best of your ability in all things, you will have pleasure and joy as your reward, but, if you seek pleasure and joy for their own sake, you will have nothing but shallow meaningless pleasures that ultimately disappoint and disgrace you.

A full answer to the question you asked would require a treatise not possible here. These are some of the fundamentals.

So wearing a mask to protect others isn't virtuous? What if a person gets another person fatally ill when it could have possibly been prevented by wearing a mask? Wouldn't that make it a moral imperative to wear a mask so long as it's of no serious detriment to the wearer? And if one does something that is immoral, wouldn't that also tend to detract from one's virtue?