attofishpi wrote:
No. I stated if knowing ALL of the future is a requirement for your definition of omniscience then i will agree it is not omniscient. My definition of all knowing is knowing everything up to the current point in time.
I don't believe it's "my definition" of omniscience, but a concept generally known of an almighty god's infinite knowledge. If you have a different concept of omniscience makes no difference, because what matters is whether your god has infinite knowledge or not. Infinite knowledge includes all knowledge of future events, which your god is incapable of.
attofishpi wrote:But let me add - i dont think it is a requirement for a God to be omni anything!!
But you did say your god was omnipotent and likely omniscient. But in any case, if your god does not have infinite power and infinite knowledge, if that's not part of its essence of being a god, in what sense it can be a god?
attofishpi wrote:
Conde Lucanor wrote:But you are inadvertently conceding also that your god is not omnipotent, since it has limitations to its knowledge derived from its impossibility to put itself in a time and space of future events.
No, you really do strain yourself with logic. An entity that does not know ALL of the future can exist in a time and space of future events.
No, that was not the argument. We are supposedly talking about an infinite being that lives simultaneously in the past, present and future, because it would not be restricted to time and space dimensions. If your god has such strict limitations, it is not all powerful and certainly not all knowing.
attofishpi wrote:
So if 10 years in the future not ALL circumstances are currently known to God, but it does have the power to put any circumstance it likes in place as time progresses, where has it lost any omnipotence?
It lost it when it was not able to control the future. It can't prevent future circumstances, so they'll be imposed on this god when it arrives to that point in time. They're circumstances it will face and yet it will be unable to avoid them.
attofishpi wrote:
How could anyone believe in an entity that knows ALL the future?? That is ridiculous but your insistance that for this entity to be a God it must, is also laughable.
You get the point!! It's ridiculous, but that's what a god is supposed to be.
https://www.gotquestions.org/infinite-God.html
attofishpi wrote:
You have brought the words such as omnipotent and omniscient into the debate - now you want me to believe God is infinite. Friggin hell - man cannot even comprehend infinity so dont expect me to start speculating over it.
First I gave you the chance to define your god as not being omnipotent and omniscient, but you voluntarily accepted those attributes as belonging to your god. Infiniteness is consubstantial to omnipotence and omniscience. It means "without limits", that is, unlimited power and unlimited knowledge.
attofishpi wrote:
I did not state it is not evident to ALL. Since God has made itself extremely evident to me over 20yrs, it is likely that there are plenty of others that have had the same degree of knowledge of its existence....certainly my sage has.
The point is that since your belief is completely subjective, it only happens between the boundaries of your own perceptions and is has no truth value to anyone else, unless you could make it objectively evident to others, which has not been the case. At best, it can be a truth valid only for yourself.
attofishpi wrote:
You are the one making the claim that God cannot control future events - as i have already explained, not knowing ALL the future does not mean it cannot CAUSE all of the future (as to how it sees fit).
If god were the ONLY CAUSE of all future events, then it would necessarily have to know all future events (because god would determine all of them). But you claim it does not know all future events, therefore accepting that at least some future events are not caused by god. Those events are out of reach of your god, become outside circumnstances it must deal with, which makes it not being all powerful.
attofishpi wrote:to claim to KNOW there is NO God, would require knowing everything about the universe, which i'm pretty certain you don't.
I can claim that no bachelor is married, without requiring to search the entire universe to attest that there's actually no married bachelor. There is no god because the idea of god is absurd.