Art and Morality

[chaz wyman]

Primarily, as a painter, I communicate visually. It is rare that I am happy with any text I write concerning my pictures, this text:

A dark cloud had descended over the earth. Culture reflected back this cloud in many different forms. The beings of earth drank it up and internalised its darkness. One being on earth stood alone, an artist. In an attempt to keep hold of the light, paintings were made. What you see here are a few of them.

...is something that for now I'm happy with, it says what I want it to say and creates the right context for the pictures. This is what I'm interested in, not whether you feel that questions have been left or other such breast beating bullshit.

It's confused.
What exactly is the earth drinking up?

[Pluto]

Okay, this is better.

It's confused, maybe. But confusion is the order of the day. A fog permeates throughout. It is non-conventional. In order to penetrate it, non-convential tools must be used. I want to name it. My work, since the start, has been positioned both in relation to it and beyond it. The work is post it.

'The earth drinking up' are your words not mine. But quite interesting all the same. I said 'the beings of earth drank it up.' Maybe we could say, that beings are the earth, so in this way and in relation to mine yours could amount to the same.

Just say, as a little experiment, what you think it means. Then I'll say what I think it means.

[chaz wyman]

Okay, this is better.

It's confused, maybe. But confusion is the order of the day. A fog permeates throughout. It is non-conventional. In order to penetrate it, non-convential tools must be used. I want to name it. My work, since the start, has been positioned both in relation to it and beyond it. The work is post it.

'The earth drinking up' are your words not mine. But quite interesting all the same. I said 'the beings of earth drank it up.' Maybe we could say, that beings are the earth, so in this way and in relation to mine yours could amount to the same.

Just say, as a little experiment, what you think it means. Then I'll say what I think it means.

Nothing much. It all depends on how you are using your terms and I have no access to that.
If you have been reading the whole thread you will know I do not think you have any clear idea of what you want to convey. You are just spilling ink on metaphors that spring to mind which you think sound good and make you sound enigmatic and intelligent.

Your turn!

[Pluto]

Jesus. I love this: "You are just spilling ink on metaphors that spring to mind which you think sound good and make you sound enigmatic and intelligent."

This isn't a competition between me and you y'know.

The limits of contemporary internet forum culture, and can we go beyond it. You were so close, then you jumped back in your iron jacket.

Just say what 'The earth drinking up' or 'the beings of earth drank it up' means as it stands in your mind in all its complexity.

[chaz wyman]

Jesus. I love this: "You are just spilling ink on metaphors that spring to mind which you think sound good and make you sound enigmatic and intelligent."

This isn't a competition between me and you y'know.

The limits of contemporary internet forum culture, and can we go beyond it. You were so close, then you jumped back in your iron jacket.

Just say what 'The earth drinking up' or 'the beings of earth drank it up' means as it stands in your mind in all its complexity.

I have been honest. You said you would tell me what you think it means too.

[Pluto]

It means the beings incorporate it into their being. Atoms absorb atoms. The beings of the earth absorb it, they drink it up. Like if I watch 20 episodes of 'Friends' I will incorporate behaviour, speech and other elements in the show into my bahaviour, speech, etc. Influenced by, programmed by. Drink it up, unconsciously and consciously.

[chaz wyman]

It means the beings incorporate it into their being. Atoms absorb atoms. The beings of the earth absorb it, they drink it up. Like if I watch 20 episodes of 'Friends' I will incorporate behaviour, speech and other elements in the show into my bahaviour, speech, etc. Influenced by, programmed by. Drink it up, unconsciously and consciously.

Why a cloud? Why dark?
It just doesn't add up.
I suppose you are the lone artist?
I can't even remember what the artist was doing.

You managed to convey nothing of the above.

Why did you not say people absorb stuff they witness?

[Pluto]

The only question I can answer is your third one. It is and it isn't me.

[chaz wyman]

The only question I can answer is your third one. It is and it isn't me.

So that would indicate that you did not even write the text to which we are referring.

Presumably that is why you don't know what it means any more than I do.

[bus2bondi]

In an age where an almost complete breakdown of morality has occured, does morality in art now hold a much more legitimate and potentially revolutionary coupling? Art as a vehicle with morality as its passenger navigate a way out or way forward from a moribund present.

i don't know, but all things considered, i think so, or would like to think so anyways.

This talk below seems to focus on whether a morally dubious artwork can be seen as good art but I'm more interested in whether an artwork can be moral in the sense of opening up a new space of hope. What would this look like. The artworks would collectively create a conduit of sorts through which you would be able to move through unimpeded. Like a non-contaminated space, where present flotsam and jetsam couldn't enter. How to make an artwork that hasn't got the dust of now in its bones. Can I make something outside the now. Why would I want to.

today driving home from work i flipped through a couple of radio stations, one had a song that had lyrics something to the effect of 'i am a war machine i am a war machine' (something like that, i think worse tho), flipped that off and on the next was '18 and Life' by Skid Row (i think most of us are familiar with that one, pretty damn moribund if you ask me), can't remember the others, and just shut the shit off.

i'm not an artist or a musician anymore, but, if i were, i would seriously consider the questions you've asked.

[bus2bondi]

you said, 'a much more legitimate', that struck me as important because legitimacy would certainly be something a human might want to consider maybe? what would be much more legitimate than what there is now.. and what isn't legitimate..

[Pluto]

Hi b2b, thanks for your post. The airwaves are infected with doom, in fact, presently (and maybe since forever) doom, destruction and mayhem sells. I'm not even sure we know what a positive reading would look or sound like yet. Perhaps, some elements associated with those who protest today, occupy etc, might hold seeds.

[Pluto]

The only question I can answer is your third one. It is and it isn't me.

So that would indicate that you did not even write the text to which we are referring.

Presumably that is why you don't know what it means any more than I do.

Would it indicate that I didn't write it, I don't know if it would. Okay so, I took it from another source and slightly adapted it to fit my idea, therefore when you ask what does it mean I can't really honestly say, is this better?

[chaz wyman]

The only question I can answer is your third one. It is and it isn't me.

So that would indicate that you did not even write the text to which we are referring.

Presumably that is why you don't know what it means any more than I do.

Would it indicate that I didn't write it, I don't know if it would. Okay so, I took it from another source and slightly adapted it to fit my idea, therefore when you ask what does it mean I can't really honestly say, is this better?

If you had admitted to your plagiarism earlier this would have avoided the argument.
Thanks for being honest.

[Pluto]

newcapitalistpyramidnt2.jpg (42.45 KiB) Viewed 4472 times

This pic, posted by Bill sometime ago, misses a crucial element of current television. TV today does not broadcast happy moving pictures of flowers and smiling faces but the opposite. It climatizes an audience to the ideas and violence happening outside your four walls. I think this is one reason for TV in prison. Yes it keeps the prisoners passive and occupied, killing boredom, maybe. But also, they will be up to speed with the zeitgeist on their release.