Deleted 500

[Age]

Yes! The way you put it does make sense. However, as thought experiments go it does contain a seeming paradox in the sense that if the universe were eternal it does not mandate the idea that any presumed type of eternal recurrence is possible or probable within it. That would require an operational universe, not one whose density and energy will become so low and tenuous, caused by the dilution of an expanding universe, where in the end, all that's left is the cold, empty space that's doomed to last forever.

But, the existing eternal Universe does not expand, and could not ever expand.

These are questions which have no relevance to life or philosophy, but as an abstraction, interesting to ponder nonetheless...at least, I think so.

How do you know that?

For a few reasons, at least:

1. The definition for the word 'Universe' includes, everything; totality; all-there-is; all existing matter and space considered as a whole.

2. Every action causes a reaction, which means there was a cause for all of the 'bangs', which obviously includes the so-called 'big bang' as well.

3. It is impossible for any thing to come from no thing.

4. When one looks out away from earth earth there could be no definitive boundary.

5. The space between and around objects/matter does not just magically stop at some imagined line at some imagined outer most planets/stars/objects. The space, or distance, from even if there were the most outer planets/stars/objects would 'have to' go on for ever.

6. Even if there could be imagined some out 'boundary' to absolutely 'everything', then 'that boundary' would have to be of a thickness, of which would be have to be of some length, or if not, then would have to infinite, itself, which if it was would be a something, and thus a part of the all existing matter and space considered as a whole. Or, if 'that boundary' was not infinitely wide itself, then it would be of some defined thickness, which means that what ever is on the other side, even if it is just 'space' only, then would also go on forever, or infinitely, and when the 'Universe' word is defined as, all existing matter and space considered as a whole; the cosmos, then this means that existing Universe does not expand, and could not ever expand.

[Dubious]

But, the existing eternal Universe does not expand, and could not ever expand.

How do you know that?

For a few reasons, at least:

1. The definition for the word 'Universe' includes, everything; totality; all-there-is; all existing matter and space considered as a whole.

2. Every action causes a reaction, which means there was a cause for all of the 'bangs', which obviously includes the so-called 'big bang' as well.

3. It is impossible for any thing to come from no thing.

4. When one looks out away from earth earth there could be no definitive boundary.

5. The space between and around objects/matter does not just magically stop at some imagined line at some imagined outer most planets/stars/objects. The space, or distance, from even if there were the most outer planets/stars/objects would 'have to' go on for ever.

6. Even if there could be imagined some out 'boundary' to absolutely 'everything', then 'that boundary' would have to be of a thickness, of which would be have to be of some length, or if not, then would have to infinite, itself, which if it was would be a something, and thus a part of the all existing matter and space considered as a whole. Or, if 'that boundary' was not infinitely wide itself, then it would be of some defined thickness, which means that what ever is on the other side, even if it is just 'space' only, then would also go on forever, or infinitely, and when the 'Universe' word is defined as, all existing matter and space considered as a whole; the cosmos, then this means that existing Universe does not expand, and could not ever expand.

There is nothing I can say that would change your mind so I'll let the science speak for itself in the following article which is quite short and not at all complicated to understand. There are many such articles available on the internet in various degrees of complexity.

It's up to you whether you want to read it or not.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/arti ... xpanding1/

[Age]

How do you know that?

For a few reasons, at least:

1. The definition for the word 'Universe' includes, everything; totality; all-there-is; all existing matter and space considered as a whole.

2. Every action causes a reaction, which means there was a cause for all of the 'bangs', which obviously includes the so-called 'big bang' as well.

3. It is impossible for any thing to come from no thing.

4. When one looks out away from earth earth there could be no definitive boundary.

5. The space between and around objects/matter does not just magically stop at some imagined line at some imagined outer most planets/stars/objects. The space, or distance, from even if there were the most outer planets/stars/objects would 'have to' go on for ever.

6. Even if there could be imagined some out 'boundary' to absolutely 'everything', then 'that boundary' would have to be of a thickness, of which would be have to be of some length, or if not, then would have to infinite, itself, which if it was would be a something, and thus a part of the all existing matter and space considered as a whole. Or, if 'that boundary' was not infinitely wide itself, then it would be of some defined thickness, which means that what ever is on the other side, even if it is just 'space' only, then would also go on forever, or infinitely, and when the 'Universe' word is defined as, all existing matter and space considered as a whole; the cosmos, then this means that existing Universe does not expand, and could not ever expand.

There is nothing I can say that would change your mind

I, nor you human beings, have 'a mind'. Once this is fully understood, then False and Wrong claims, like the one you just made here, will stop being made.

so I'll let the science speak for itself in the following article which is quite short and not at all complicated to understand. There are many such articles available on the internet in various degrees of complexity.

It's up to you whether you want to read it or not.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/arti ... xpanding1/

Oh, and by the way, I could also remark that there is nothing I can say that would change your views and beliefs here. But, that will never ever mean they my views are Right and yours are Wrong, or do you believe otherwise?

I also noticed that you did not pick one of my numbered points and question nor challenge them at all.

Why was this?

[Age]

https://www.scientificamerican.com/arti ... xpanding1/

From your link, which by the way provides absolutely nothing that could remotely be used as actual prove of an expanding Universe, what is first noticed is that the 'presumption' that the Universe is expanding is believed to be true from the outset.

The heading or title, 'Will the Universe ever stop expanding?', is like a "theist" automatically believing that some God Thing created the Universe. Where is the actual proof that the Universe is expanding, before asking a question around that it is an already proved fact that the Universe is actually expanding?

Are you able to provide the actual proof that the Universe is expanding?

If yes, then I shall wait for that.

But, if no, then why do you, and others, believe that the Universe is expanding?

Now, I can show, with actual proof, that the Universe is not expanding and cannot expand. But, I can and will only do this through a discussion.

I have already provided some of the reasons why the Universe is not and cannot expand, and if none of you have the ability, nor want, to question and/or challenge me over those reasons, then so be it.

Remember, you asked me, 'How do I know that the existing eternal Universe does not expand, and could not ever expand?' I did the decent thing and provided you with just some of the reasons of how I know this. Now let us see if anyone has the decency, or the ability, to keep this discussion going.

Oh, and by the way, why all of the inconsistencies, contradictions, and False and Wrong beliefs that exist within that link, and within the links within that link, can be very easily and very simply explained.

[Dubious]

https://www.scientificamerican.com/arti ... xpanding1/

From your link, which by the way provides absolutely nothing that could remotely be used as actual prove of an expanding Universe, what is first noticed is that the 'presumption' that the Universe is expanding is believed to be true from the outset.

The heading or title, 'Will the Universe ever stop expanding?', is like a "theist" automatically believing that some God Thing created the Universe. Where is the actual proof that the Universe is expanding, before asking a question around that it is an already proved fact that the Universe is actually expanding?

Are you able to provide the actual proof that the Universe is expanding?

If yes, then I shall wait for that.

But, if no, then why do you, and others, believe that the Universe is expanding?

Now, I can show, with actual proof, that the Universe is not expanding and cannot expand. But, I can and will only do this through a discussion.

I have already provided some of the reasons why the Universe is not and cannot expand, and if none of you have the ability, nor want, to question and/or challenge me over those reasons, then so be it.

Remember, you asked me, 'How do I know that the existing eternal Universe does not expand, and could not ever expand?' I did the decent thing and provided you with just some of the reasons of how I know this. Now let us see if anyone has the decency, or the ability, to keep this discussion going.

Oh, and by the way, why all of the inconsistencies, contradictions, and False and Wrong beliefs that exist within that link, and within the links within that link, can be very easily and very simply explained.

It became known in 1929 that the universe expands and in 1998 that the expansion is accelerating. That's the science; if you, instead, prefer your opinions, so be it.

[Age]

https://www.scientificamerican.com/arti ... xpanding1/

From your link, which by the way provides absolutely nothing that could remotely be used as actual prove of an expanding Universe, what is first noticed is that the 'presumption' that the Universe is expanding is believed to be true from the outset.

The heading or title, 'Will the Universe ever stop expanding?', is like a "theist" automatically believing that some God Thing created the Universe. Where is the actual proof that the Universe is expanding, before asking a question around that it is an already proved fact that the Universe is actually expanding?

Are you able to provide the actual proof that the Universe is expanding?

If yes, then I shall wait for that.

But, if no, then why do you, and others, believe that the Universe is expanding?

Now, I can show, with actual proof, that the Universe is not expanding and cannot expand. But, I can and will only do this through a discussion.

I have already provided some of the reasons why the Universe is not and cannot expand, and if none of you have the ability, nor want, to question and/or challenge me over those reasons, then so be it.

Remember, you asked me, 'How do I know that the existing eternal Universe does not expand, and could not ever expand?' I did the decent thing and provided you with just some of the reasons of how I know this. Now let us see if anyone has the decency, or the ability, to keep this discussion going.

Oh, and by the way, why all of the inconsistencies, contradictions, and False and Wrong beliefs that exist within that link, and within the links within that link, can be very easily and very simply explained.

It became known in 1929 that the universe expands and in 1998 that the expansion is accelerating. That's the science; if you, instead, prefer your opinions, so be it.

So, you just accept what is told to you.

Look "dubious" there is absolutely no proof that the Universe is expanding, and if you have the courage to put forward what you think or believe is 'the data', which is used as 'evidence' for the claim that the Universe is expanding, then I will show, and prove, why 'that data' is being misinterpreted and used Wrongly as 'evidence' for the claim the Universe is expanding.

However, if you do not provide anything, then, obviously, there is nothing at all for 'us' to look at and discuss.

I have, obviously, already provided just some reasons for why the Universe is not expanding and never could. And, just as obvious is the fact that you have not questioned nor challenged those reasons at all, nor in anyway countered those reasons.

Again, if there is absolutely anyone who has the courage to discuss this here, then by all means please let us do. Until then the claim that the Universe is expanding is not backed up by absolutely anything, except of course other than just what some people think or believe is true. Which is exactly what the claim God created the Universe is backed up and supported by.

Obviously, just thinking or believing that the Universe is expanding never means that the Universe is, and the fact that there is no actual proof that the Universe is expanding just reinforces that the only thing anyone has in regards to the claim that the Universe is nothing more than just what they think or believe is true.

And the fact that no one wants to discuss this topic here with me further shows and highlights that no one here has any proof for the claim that the Universe is expanding.

[Age]

https://www.scientificamerican.com/arti ... xpanding1/

From your link, which by the way provides absolutely nothing that could remotely be used as actual prove of an expanding Universe, what is first noticed is that the 'presumption' that the Universe is expanding is believed to be true from the outset.

The heading or title, 'Will the Universe ever stop expanding?', is like a "theist" automatically believing that some God Thing created the Universe. Where is the actual proof that the Universe is expanding, before asking a question around that it is an already proved fact that the Universe is actually expanding?

Are you able to provide the actual proof that the Universe is expanding?

If yes, then I shall wait for that.

But, if no, then why do you, and others, believe that the Universe is expanding?

Now, I can show, with actual proof, that the Universe is not expanding and cannot expand. But, I can and will only do this through a discussion.

I have already provided some of the reasons why the Universe is not and cannot expand, and if none of you have the ability, nor want, to question and/or challenge me over those reasons, then so be it.

Remember, you asked me, 'How do I know that the existing eternal Universe does not expand, and could not ever expand?' I did the decent thing and provided you with just some of the reasons of how I know this. Now let us see if anyone has the decency, or the ability, to keep this discussion going.

Oh, and by the way, why all of the inconsistencies, contradictions, and False and Wrong beliefs that exist within that link, and within the links within that link, can be very easily and very simply explained.

It became known in 1929 that the universe expands and in 1998 that the expansion is accelerating.

It also became 'known' that God created the Universe a long time before so-called '1929' and in the very day this is being written it is still known that a male gendered God created the Universe, by some.

Now, for those some that, still, LOL 'know' that the Universe expands and/or that that expansion is accelerating what actual 'proof' do you have for this 'knowing'?

Until this is presented, then you might as well tell 'us' that God is a "he" and that "he" created the Universe.

That's the science; if you, instead, prefer your opinions, so be it.

Saying, 'that's the science, as though then what you say and claim is irrefutably True and Fact is about as absurd as saying that, 'God is a "he" and "he" created the Universe', because it says so in a book.

Honestly, you people here really need to learn how to back up and support what you believe, say, and claim is true.

[Dubious]

Now, for those some that, still, LOL 'know' that the Universe expands and/or that that expansion is accelerating what actual 'proof' do you have for this 'knowing'?

Redshift, among others, being a physical fact.

[Age]

Now, for those some that, still, LOL 'know' that the Universe expands and/or that that expansion is accelerating what actual 'proof' do you have for this 'knowing'?

Redshift, among others, being a physical fact.

you must have misread or misunderstood my actual question here. I asked for 'actual proof'.

Although 'redshift' may well be a 'physical fact', with and through some 'instruments', 'redshift', itself, is not proof nor a 'physical fact' that the Universe is expanding.

Also, before I move on, can I also say, 'I have 'something', among others, as being physical facts', in regards to the Universe is not expanding, and that 'that' is all I need to say for this to be settled here?

If no, then why did you presume you could?

Now, if you would like to delve into and discuss more about 'redshift' then by all means let 'us' do so.

However, if you just want to accept and believe that the word 'redshift' alone, which you have heard or seen somewhere, from other human beings, means absolutely and irrefutably that the whole Universe, Itself, is expanding, then please continue on doing so.

By the way the actual physical fact of 'redshift', and 'blueshift' as well, shows and proves how the Universe, Itself, is not actually expanding at all. And, only if one is curious and/or interest to learn and know why, then only those ones can learn, and know, more things here.