Peter Holmes wrote: ↑Sun Jan 23, 2022 10:43 am
Age wrote: ↑Sun Jan 23, 2022 3:24 am
Peter Holmes wrote: ↑Sat Jan 22, 2022 1:11 pm
1 What I want done to me is morally right; and what I don't want done to me is morally wrong.
Until you list those 'things', then this is just nonsense.
Peter Holmes wrote: ↑Sat Jan 22, 2022 1:11 pm
2 Morality can be objective - there are moral facts, regardless of what anyone thinks or wants done to them.
Is there?
If yes, then what are they, exactly?
And, what are you basing this claim on exactly?
Peter Holmes wrote: ↑Sat Jan 22, 2022 1:11 pm
Spot the contradiction?
The contradiction that you have created here is OBVIOUS. I wrote what I did specifically. See, I have left out how it is possible to DISCOVER what thee ACTUAL and IRREFUTABLE Truth IS. Like I have done in a lot of my replies. I seek those who are Truly curious and NOT those who want to TELL us what they BELIEVE is true.
If you are not curious at all, then just proceed as you are. We already know that you BELIEVE WHOLEHEARTEDLY that morality can only be subjective, so you are obviously NOT open to discovering ANY thing new here. We also KNOW that you are only FIXATED on presenting your OWN CLOSED VIEWS as though they are the only one that is right and correct here.
You are prepared to argue and fight for your own tightly held FIXED position only correct?
Would you be prepared to consider and ask how this OBVIOUSLY APPARENT "contradiction" could be explained away? Or, are you just that NOT OPEN yet?
Are you just going to REMAIN SO COMPLETELY CLOSED and so just going to continue to LOOK AT at 'things' here from your OWN made up FIXED view and position, or are you able to SHOW and PROVE that you are somewhat OPEN and so able to discover and learn more and anew?
Remember NOT ALL of what SEEMS to be a "contradiction" is necessarily a 'contradiction' at all. The same applies with ALL views, beliefs, perceptions, et cetera.
Please stop whingeing and coat-trailing. If you think it isn't a contradiction, show why it isn't.
But, to you, it can NOT be ANY thing other than a contradiction, correct?
If yes, then I, literally, can NOT SHOW 'you' WHY 'it' is NOT a contradiction.
Are you ABLE to UNDERSTAND this Fact?
I, however, can and will SHOW 'others' EXACTLY WHY 'it' is NOT a contradiction.
Also, I could have also said, 'Please stop whingeing and 'coat-trailing' (whatever that means)" and start listing what is EXACTLY morally wrong to you and what is morally right, to you, and then you can start to just answer the second CLARIFYING question as well.
Peter Holmes wrote: ↑Sun Jan 23, 2022 10:39 am
If you think there are moral facts, so that morality is objective, show an example of a moral fact.
BUT, I can NOT SHOW and example of a 'moral fact', to you, when, to you, this is an IMPOSSIBILITY, correct?
Peter Holmes wrote: ↑Sun Jan 23, 2022 10:39 am
Otherwise, this is a waste of time and effort for all of us.
So, WHY AGAIN, START these threads?
What is a True WASTE of time is trying to SHOW and PROVE some 'thing' to some one who BELIEVES otherwise. It is, literally, IMPOSSIBLE to do so. This is because the one with a BELIEF is NOT able to see NOR hear ANY thing other than what they BELIEVE is true. And, YOUR WORDS here are PROVING this IRREFUTABLY True.
Asking the question, "Is morality objective or subjective?", when to that one morality can ONLY EVER be subjective, is a PRIME example of 'trolling'. That is; putting out the 'bait' and then seeing who they can 'hook' and 'reel' in.
This would be just like asking; Does God exist?" when one BELIEVES that God could NEVER exist.
You are COMPLETELY and UTTERLY CLOSED here, so this REALLY is a True WASTE of time and effort for all of us here.
WHY did you START this thread, especially when, to you, there is ONLY ONE POSSIBLE answer?