Philosophy Now Forum

In Audre Lorde's Uses of the Erotic, she explains why erotic and pornographic are opposites. Erotic is derived from the Greek words eros, which is the personification of love in all of its aspects and creative power and harmony. Lorde describes the erotic as, "an internal sense of satisfaction to which, once we have experienced it, we know we can aspire. For having experienced the fullness of this depth of feeling and recognizing its power, in honor and self-respect we can require no less of ourselves" (570). Pornography, on the other hand, as described by Lorde, "is a direct denial of the power of erotic, for it represents the suppression of true feeling. Pornography emphasizes sensation without feeling" (570). Lorde writes that erotic gives us the opportunity to have the power by sharing deep feelings with others, while pornography, as Andrea Dworkin explains in Against the Male Flood, through sexual subordination, and more specifically the hierarchy of it, allows males to have power over women (30). The erotic is to feel and embrace one's emotions, while the pornographic suppresses these feelings. To conclude, Audre Lorde says, "To refuse to be conscious of what we are feeling at any time, however comfortable that might seem, is to deny a large part of the experience, and to allow ourselves to be reduced to the pornographic, the abused, and the absurd" (574).

I don't know about this. I don't prescribe to the thought that if one thing is 'good'...it's counterpart must be 'bad'. I don't know why the two can be part of the general notion of love and sex.

Isn't a lustful encounter sometimes just as special and satisfying as a loving 'full-bodied' experience? I am speaking merely of our memories here. If we are in a loving relationship....isn't it that more often than not...we remember the early love making sessions...when love was new and alive and exciting? After awhile...when love builds stronger perhaps...and there becomes a unbreakable bond....and lovemaking is an everyday occurrence...doesn't erotica wane a little?

I am just asking. How many here remember every time they made love to someone they were with a long time who we had deep feelings for...as opposed to the occasions we had a fantastic love making session worthy of declaring our "best" ever?

Are we not able to say one was great for the deep love we had for another...and yet another sexual encounter was great for the sheer adventure? It would be the difference between loving the sea vs. loving your homeland, I think.

The distinction between the erotic and the pornographic is a matter of taste, and taste is determined by history, class and experience. One man's eroticism is another woman's pornography; and one person's eroticism is another's art.

I am more inclined towards artisticsolution and Chaz on this one, having a personal preference to experience the erotic aspects of everyday life, art, music...

Art Durkee raised the same question on his blog through the eyes of an artist - http://artdurkee.blogspot.co.uk/2007/03/erotica-vs-pornography.htm

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Well it's not 'erotic', as such, nor is it in any way 'art', but it is strangely compelling to watch, and I'll take the one with the pink top.

[1] Thanks for posting. This work deeply moved and inspired me,

"The erotic is spiritual and biophilic; but patriarchy is necrophilic; patriarchy hates love and life. Third-wave feminist Audre Lorde speaks to the psychology of male chauvinism in her "The Uses of the Erotic:": "there are frequent attempts to equate pornography and eroticism: two diametrically opposed uses of the sexual, because of these attempts, it has become fashionable to separate the spiritual, psychic and emotional from the political, to see them as contradictory or antithetical...""

http://youtu.be/_fbWUweNlmU?t=2m15s

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Your point is what, exactly?

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What is your reaction to that GIF?



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To ask you what is you point.
What sort of thrill do you get by asking people what they get out of a rude picture?
How is it "Philosophy"?

If the athlete knew what you were doing, do you think she would be pleased to see how you are behaving?
Do you think she would enjoy being used in this way by a childish moron?

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I had a double post...sorry.



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Whoa...whoa! Wait a minute!




I asked another member in another thread of mine to look with philosophical eyes.


When you said, getting a thrill out of a rude picture, that was you, not me.


When you stated, If the athlete knew what you were doing, do you think she would be pleased to see how you are behaving? you are referring to the feeling you had, not me.


When you used the terms childish moron, I contest, that is how you feel about yourself, your reactions, not me.



Matter of fact, you don't know ANYTHING about the way I have perceived that image.



All you have to go on is your perceptions, your feelings, your reactions to your information in relation to this image.


THERE! THAT'S PHILOSOPHY.

THAT is, How is it "Philosophy"






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Regarding the image of the runner. I have been in that position before....

Only not as a runner!

Ha ha...yuk yuk,,,nudge nudge...wink wink.

But seriously, You are right Bill...no one can know how you perceive that image...and no one can know how the woman would perceive herself as other people are looking at her. I am not a runner...but I think every woman at one time or another has felt the eyes of a man on her....and speaking from experience...the LAST thing you are thinking is that the man might be thinking you are an object of beauty. You usually feel as if something is all ugly and jiggling and people are noticing it because it is not normal....like maybe you have a piece of toilet paper hanging or something!

One time....in one of my more embarrassing moments...my best girlfriend and i went on vacation...before the vacation I had seen the most beautiful dress in the world...the only problem was it cost 200 dollars which back then was very very expensive....but I had to have this dress...it was off the shoulders, white gossamer type film with a hem line like stevie nicks used to wear...but it was very sheer and feminine..... like maybe a fairy would wear....I loved it! Anyway, I did the unthinkable...I bought it even though I could not really afford it!

So...fast forward...we are on vacation and I brought my dress to wearing to dinner but I forgot to pack the right type of undergarments... a slip (which was soooo needed for this particular dress) and a strapless bra. Luckily my girlfriend had a slip I could borrow...but the only think is it was too big....so I kinda jimmied it rolled it up and tucked it into my bra...and then I took my bra straps down a tucked them into the sides. I was damned and determined to wear my dress....but underneath I was a mess! lol

So anyway, I get all put together and we go to dinner. It was one of those nice places where the waiters and bus boys practically just stand at the side of your table waiting on your every need...anyway...the bus boy would not stop staring at me....and you know how that feels when you are eating...you're thinking you have food on your face or somehow a piece of spaghetti is dangling like an earring or something..it was very uncomfortable. I could not wait to get out of there!

So after the meal, my girlfriend and I stand up and head for the elevators. She is walking ahead of me very very slow as we make our way through the restaurant, while I could feel the bus boys eyes drilling a hole through my back....so I get really close to her so to try to move her along more quickly but I wasn't expecting a steps in the middle of the restaurant....so when she goes to step up, I am so close her heel gets cause in the hem of my gossamer dress and pulls it down to my waist...exposing my make shift undergarments (and other unmentionables)...complete with slip tucked into bra...straps hanging down and all!

She kinda trips as I pull my dress up to cover myself causing the hem to rip even more...the only thing is...she was completely unaware that I had exposed myself to the entire place! She thought she was the only one who was embarrassed.....and in my shock...all I could think or say to cover my humiliation was, "you ripped my 200 dress!"
as if that was the height of my worries!

Well we get back to the room and had the only fight we have ever had in our life long friendship. She thought I was blaming her for my dress being ripped! A few moments later we both calmed down and I told her what had happened behind her...LOL.

To this day we cherish the story of our first fight ever.

Oh...where was I...oh yeah...that girl with the jiggly butt....she too has not idea what you are thinking about her pic. She may or may not think you think she is a thing of beauty. But then you would have no idea what she was thinking about your reaction to her image.

A look is just a look...it doesn't mean anything as there is no way to tell what lies beneath.