Homosexuality.

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Harbal
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Re: Homosexuality.

Post by Harbal » Sat Apr 22, 2017 7:19 pm

vegetariantaxidermy wrote:Stephen Fry isn't like that.
Actually, I think our culture would be a lot poorer without a certain kind of gay personality. Stephen Fry is immensely entertaining and there's the wit of people like Joe Lycett and even Julian Clary -I don't know how well they're known outside the UK. Oscar Wilde is also acknowledged as being quite witty. In fact, I think the only thing wrong with gay people is that there aren't enough of them. I wish I had a gay friend.

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vegetariantaxidermy
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Re: Homosexuality.

Post by vegetariantaxidermy » Sat Apr 22, 2017 7:29 pm

Harbal wrote:
vegetariantaxidermy wrote:Stephen Fry isn't like that.
Actually, I think our culture would be a lot poorer without a certain kind of gay personality. Stephen Fry is immensely entertaining and there's the wit of people like Joe Lycett and even Julian Clary -I don't know how well they're known outside the UK. Oscar Wilde is also acknowledged as being quite witty. In fact, I think the only thing wrong with gay people is that there aren't enough of them. I wish I had a gay friend.
True. They do tend to be entertaining and interesting (provided they aren't closeted kkkristian preachers). I used to really fancy Stephen Fry in his Fry and Laurie days. :)

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Harbal
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Re: Homosexuality.

Post by Harbal » Sat Apr 22, 2017 7:43 pm

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: True. They do tend to be entertaining and interesting (provided they aren't closeted kkkristian preachers). I used to really fancy Stephen Fry in his Fry and Laurie days. :)
Thank heaven you've turned up, VT, you're like the sun coming out on a cloudy day. :)

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vegetariantaxidermy
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Re: Homosexuality.

Post by vegetariantaxidermy » Sat Apr 22, 2017 8:04 pm

Harbal wrote:
vegetariantaxidermy wrote: True. They do tend to be entertaining and interesting (provided they aren't closeted kkkristian preachers). I used to really fancy Stephen Fry in his Fry and Laurie days. :)
Thank heaven you've turned up, VT, you're like the sun coming out on a cloudy day. :)
:)

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Greta
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Re: Homosexuality.

Post by Greta » Sat Apr 22, 2017 11:05 pm

I just think it would help if people didn't stick their noses into others' private lives.

When I was young and sexually active I would have hated being pressured into having relationships with other women and judged as disgusting for having sex with men I liked. That's what the world must feel like to young gay people.

This kind of pointless cruelty ("for the good of society" rationales are laughably weak) used to infuriate me. Oh well, it's just a few more people suffering and suiciding pointlessly. The suffering of millions of innocents who happen to be gay will be just a drop compared with the tsunami of despair and horror facing billions in the coming decades.

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GreatandWiseTrixie
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Re: Homosexuality.

Post by GreatandWiseTrixie » Tue Oct 24, 2017 1:12 am

vegetariantaxidermy wrote:
Fri Apr 21, 2017 11:43 pm
Homosexuality: yet another thing the yanks have ruined. If they are just men who are attracted to other men then why all the obnoxious affectations? The whiny, high-pitched voices, the cattiness, the waxed eyebrows, the fake tans, the general shallow annoyingness that a large number of them carry on with? Why the talk of 'gay culture'? FFS.
Trying to understand gays is like trying to understand lesbians. Most gays have fucked up, messed up childhoods and their Brain is just full of all these webs of confusion. I swear to god I have met gays who told me that They lust for women's breasts. I have met gays who reject strong alpha males and date weird creepy cripples. I have met lesbians who say that a hot feminine transsexual is too masculine for them, then date some butch female who looks the same as a Man. Then they tell me its that penis is disgusting, but they will eat a fish taco that smells so bad you can smell it from 20 feet away.

If you want to understand gays, look at Andy Warhol. He litterally made a movie of a camera photographing the Empire State Building for 8 hours and called it "art". Just utter fuckery.

xman
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Re: Homosexuality.

Post by xman » Mon Nov 13, 2017 7:23 am

I hate to be unpleasant here, but some things need to be said: 1) Many of the postings here are vicious, bigoted, homophobic, ignorant, and they piss me off! If they had been said about any other oppressed group such as blacks, Jews, Muslims, etc., they would have been yanked down immediately by the Monitor. I suppose it is because these here are just about silly queers who can't be taken seriously anyway. I am gay, and I am so glad I am! I have worked for LGBT liberation for many years. I have written, marched, organised--whatever I could--and I have been trashed and abused by straights all my life, even an attempted rape by a superior officer who knew I was gay, and assaulted me in my quarters one night by shouting homophobic insults at me at the same time trying to tear my clothes off--boy did he have some cognitive dissonance problems! Well, for all of you who think we are all nelly screaming queens (and let me quickly add that outrageous gays have all the right to be whatever they want to be), I was a merchant seaman for the first half of my working life, and I present as very macho: beard, tattoos, pirate earring etc.,--the whole show, and I love it. (It also attracts guys.) 2) We LGBTs are sick and tired of straights wading in to discuss us in pseudo-intellectual jargon which reveals them as hopelessly clued-out. As Shakespeare put it, "They jest at scars that never felt a wound." It disgusted Romeo, and it disgusts me too. 3) You are discussing this as Object in the sense of Hume and Kant--and you should know enough about critical thinking to know how irresponsible THAT is--while we prancing, preening, eyebrow-plucking perverts experience it as Subject. This, my friends, makes all the difference in the world. I wish the Monitors would establish an LGBT site which would be inhabited by us perverts--while straight tourists were welcome to visit and read, but to think twice before posting their insights, thus rushing in where angels fear to tread--with an LGBT monitor.

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Arising_uk
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Re: Homosexuality.

Post by Arising_uk » Mon Nov 13, 2017 12:57 pm

I think you'll find that all have been equally insulted here and those insulted are free to respond. Why do you want special treatment?

davidm
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Re: Homosexuality.

Post by davidm » Mon Nov 13, 2017 5:52 pm

xman wrote:
Mon Nov 13, 2017 7:23 am
I hate to be unpleasant here, but some things need to be said: 1) Many of the postings here are vicious, bigoted, homophobic, ignorant, and they piss me off! If they had been said about any other oppressed group such as blacks, Jews, Muslims, etc., they would have been yanked down immediately by the Monitor.
Nope! Read around a bit. Every form of bigotry, and every fuckwit bigot, is happily accommodated here, numerous threads being plastered with such posts. Heck, here, blacks are even called coloreds again -- shades of Jim Crow 1960!

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henry quirk
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there's the root...

Post by henry quirk » Mon Nov 13, 2017 6:34 pm

Why do you want special treatment?

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GreatandWiseTrixie
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Re: there's the root...

Post by GreatandWiseTrixie » Mon Nov 13, 2017 7:30 pm

henry quirk wrote:
Mon Nov 13, 2017 6:34 pm
Why do you want special treatment?
Everyone deserves special treatment, based on their own unique crimes.
davidm wrote:
Mon Nov 13, 2017 5:52 pm
Nope! Read around a bit. Every form of bigotry, and every fuckwit bigot, is happily accommodated here, numerous threads being plastered with such posts. Heck, here, blacks are even called coloreds again -- shades of Jim Crow 1960!
I am probably the least bigotted person on here.
I hate Whites, Blacks, Gays and Straights. I hate them all. I remember all the crimes of humanity, I do not forgive, I do not forget.
trashed and abused by straights all my life, even an attempted rape by a superior officer who knew I was gay, and assaulted me in my quarters one night by shouting homophobic insults at me at the same time trying to tear my clothes off--boy did he have some cognitive dissonance problems!
I think you are the one with cognitive dissonance, because you just try to imply that your bisexual or gay superior officer was straight.
"Ive been harassed by straight people so much, one of them wanted to have sex with me!"
Naw man. If they want to have sex with your macho, beard booty, they aren't straight.

And I am welcome to my opinion. 95% of gay porn nauseates me. And so actually I'm the victim of it. It seems like the gay lifestyle is shoved in my face, lusting after men seems more culturally acceptable in america than lusting after women. Like if I lust after women, they shame me and say I'm not a true transsexual, but if lust after men they celebrate and give me a sticker. But even for heterosexual men, if they lust after women, they get shamed and accused they objectify women, but if they lust after men, people celebrate and give them a sticker.

It really has nothing to do with morals, ethics or even politics. I have no problem with lesbian porn. Its just when I go on porn sites, and I accidentally see a gay porn ad, it nauseates me, doesnt look or feel right to me. Has nothing to do with morals ethics or politics whatsoever, its just my inherent natural reflex to it.
I wish the Monitors would establish an LGBT site which would be inhabited by us perverts--while straight tourists were welcome to visit and read, but to think twice before posting their insights, thus rushing in where angels fear to tread--with an LGBT monitor.
And it seems your LGBT agenda is just to facist censor and dictate everyone's opinions, and silence all outsiders, like the straight people used to do in the 60's, the straight people you love to complain about...well you are acting exactly the same as them. Like I said, I never forgive the crimes of humanity.

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henry quirk
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Post by henry quirk » Mon Nov 13, 2017 10:04 pm

"Everyone deserves special treatment, based on their own unique crimes."

HA!

Best answer of the day!

Gold Star for Trix!

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GreatandWiseTrixie
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Re:

Post by GreatandWiseTrixie » Mon Nov 13, 2017 10:10 pm

henry quirk wrote:
Mon Nov 13, 2017 10:04 pm
"Everyone deserves special treatment, based on their own unique crimes."

HA!

Best answer of the day!

Gold Star for Trix!
Thankyou. 8)

xman
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Re: Homosexuality.

Post by xman » Tue Nov 14, 2017 2:14 am

I must applaud DavidM here for his marvellously sardonic comment that I was quite wrong to think that LGBTs were somehow being singled out for hatred and that PhiloN is an equal-opportunity bigotry site. Henry and Arising focus on my seeming plea for acceptance for my own community--”special treatment?” Before I explain just why I seem to be asking for this, let me mention a couple of things about me that will tell you where I am coming from on this issue. 1) A very wise man who knows me very well once told me that I should choose my battles carefully since to do otherwise would be to scatter my forces. I centre my efforts on the LGBT struggle because it is MY struggle. I do NOT thereby discount other struggles for acceptance; I have always been involved in social justice of all sorts. 2) I take my cues from Kant and Heidegger—from Kant for morality, from Heidegger for how I see myself operating in the world—i.e., that I am not a sort of Cartesian ego in an empty world, but, instead, Being-in-the-world, Dasein, which suggests to me that I must act at all times, in a world crowded with dark and sinister forces—as well as bright hope—if I am to have any hope of “authenticity” in the Heideggerean/Sartrean sense.

All the replies seem to be telling me that I shouldn't be surprised or put off by cruelty and bigotry here at all. Well, I AM! In the Groundwork, and lots of other places, Kant says that our in our actions we should “Act only on that maxim through which you can at the same time will that it should become a universal law”--the Categorical Imperative we know so well. Are you guys seriously telling me that you WILL that hate speech directed at specific groups, which is very cruel and leads to consequences more evil that the speech itself is something everyone should do? “Oh,” you say, “It isn't the consequences of the hate speech we are willing as our End, it is the freedom to speak that is the End. That is what we are pointing at when we say you should lighten up—humans are fallible.” Indeed they are, but your argument would then be that hurting other people is a legitimate End. I doubt that can be justified. Kant is famous for saying “I ought means I can.” I suggest this brings us to another way of stating the Categorical Imperative: rational beings should be treated as Ends, not as Means to an end. We are talking moral actions here, actions that you will to be done even if they do not square with your opinions and inclinations. If you are so driven by bigoted beliefs within you that you are unable to rise above them, then you are not free, and the issue wallows in expediency and stuff you should be telling your shrink, not putting forward as an apodictic law.

Fingers can and should be pointed at those posting hate speech AND at those who read it and remain silent. In the midst of the AIDS genocide the gay warning was Silence is Death. It still is. My criticism here is aimed at straight people, although frankly I don't expect much from them; I am really aiming at my fellow LGBTs (I just can't be the only one here!) who should at least be opposed to homophobia to the extent of speaking out online—you are not in physical danger here. To my brother and sister LGBTs I urge you not to be reduced to slacktitude. I live my life convinced that we have a moral obligation to speak out and act to further our liberation—to the extent that is possible in our own unique circumstance. The End that we are looking for is freedom from discounting, bullying, bashing, injury, imprisonment and death for something that goes to the very core of our being. Our End is our human rights—they are moral, they are universal, they are NOT derived from straight people's personal approval, they are not subject to popularity contest.

davidm
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Re: Homosexuality.

Post by davidm » Tue Nov 14, 2017 2:47 am

Brilliant post, xman. Very astute invocations of Kant, Heidegger and Descartes as well -- don't think this is a philosophy forum, though. I trust you've read around a bit. Almost everyone here wouldn't know philosophy from a donut. In addition to the gay bashers we've got the standard-issue racists, misogynists, transphobes, Islamaphobes and other such odious specimens. Of course these clowns are nowhere near a majority here, but they are the ones that do the most forum spamming -- with not a peep of protest from the powers that be.

And then too there are the evolution and relativity deniers, and the Christers who think Jesus is going to throw you into a lake of fire forever because you had the temerity to have sex with a member of your own gender, or just because you didn't believe in Jesus! All in all a bunch of bats that flew out of the cellar when President Cheeto Benito flung open the trap door.

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