Am I a man or a woman?

Anything to do with gender and the status of women and men.

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vegetariantaxidermy
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Re: Am I a man or a woman?

Post by vegetariantaxidermy » Wed Apr 26, 2017 7:56 pm

ForCruxSake wrote:
vegetariantaxidermy wrote:
ForCruxSake wrote: Did I say the Japanese were racist??? I said they had a right to their culture. It's you who considers them racist. It's all a game to you. You don't care about anyone, you just want to appear an intellectual warrior. However I would have replied, my answer would have been something for you to try to beat me to death.
It's their country isn't it? When my father went to Japan in the early 1970s as a journalist he was taken aback when Japanese wouldn't get into lifts with him. He certainly didn't get all precious about it. I think he thought it was quite funny. I asked if you think they are racist for wanting to protect their culture (they are especially adamant about keeping muslims out).
But you didn't ask. You framed a question hoping to trap me into some kind of answer that might suggest they were racist. And here you are trying, rather poorly, might I add, to do the same thing.
vegetariantaxidermy wrote:Clearly you do not.
How do you even know? Your clearly did not ask the question, preferring to ask what I thought of the Japanese not allowing immigrants, and I stated they had a right to self-determination. You've somehow deluded yourself into thinking my answer suggests more than it states.
vegetariantaxidermy wrote:Yet you dismissively effectively say that the English should suck it up and accept that their own cultural identity is fast disappearing, citing some minute minorites from centuries ago that were readily absorbed into the general population. You can hardly compare that with turning the host population into a minority group.

Who on earth is this 'pure' host population? It's not the English, because a lot of the second generation Somalians , and second, third and fourth generation Pakistanis around my way, are English. We're a mix of different cultures... Particularly in the cities. The 'purest' form of culture in England is displayed by the Cornish, or so they claim, out on the limb of England, and even they are 'riddled with' other Brits.

This is my country, as much as anyone else allowed citizenship here, and we have freedom of movement, freedom to worship and freedom to do just about anything as long as no laws are broken. Suits me fine.

You are inventing the idea of an indigenous population becoming a minority group. I live here and I see plenty of white people whose families go back generations, I don't really care about flag waving nationalism or who feels they have the greatest right to live here, and how, because generations ago their French forefathers beat the English at the Battle of Hastings. I care about now and the country our children are growing up in. I don't want them to carry the filth of your sort of divisive hatred. Pushing people to fight, Backing them into corners so you feel that you have the right to hit them over the head.

I seek to live in peace, as pleasantly as possible with those around me, and only kick out at bullies, which you and Harbal show yourself to be, time and time again, in some sort of pathetic game of wits aimed at demeaning those who would openly discuss subjects with you.
vegetariantaxidermy wrote:Let me spell it out for you. You call people 'racist' for valuing their culture, but that 'racism' only seems to apply to certain cultures. You think it's fine for the Japanese to do this. I was simply wondering why. Is that too difficult a question for you?
Now let me spell it it out for you: I call people racist HERE for refusing to accept other cultures HERE with grace. Cultures change over time, nothing remains pure anyway. To lash out with hatred at people of different cultures, who you've invited, or allowed in HERE, to your space, who live without breaking the law, a bit differently, is an affront to humanity. Valuing your culture is not the problem. Despising others for theirs, and how it pollutes or overtaken yours, is a value loaded judgment that leads to the kind of hatred I call 'racism'. That's the problem. Is that clear enough or are you determined to twist the sense of that, too?

I say what I say. You take what want from it but do not try repackage your understanding of what I am saying, to suggest that that is what I am actually saying. You do that an awful lot and much time is wasted, as people have to repeat over and over again the statements they make, that you have bent to fit your own agenda.
So when you are off on your little do-gooding adventures, I hope you never use the word 'culture', because there is no-one 'pure' (the word 'pure' being entirely yours) enough to warrant being part of a 'culture'. This won't happen of course. You probably use the word 1000 times a day, when you are lecturing all and sundry to 'respect their/my/our' culture. Do you specialise in defending islamic 'cultural practices' by any chance? I mean, there are a billion muslims, and some branches of it detest each other. Doesn't sound very 'pure' to me. Heck, even your favourite word 'multiCULTURALism' has the word bang in the middle of it :lol: Anyway, I'm pretty sure the English know whether or not they are English. I have never heard a single one of them describe themselves as 'nothing really'. You even said you aren't English, but a 'Brit'. There was no 'trick question'. Just a simple question. If you felt 'tricked and cornered' then that says it all really. You don't need to answer it.

''I seek to live in peace, as pleasantly as possible with those around me, and only kick out at bullies''.
You really must stop spoiling me with all this irony.
Last edited by vegetariantaxidermy on Wed Apr 26, 2017 8:31 pm, edited 2 times in total.

ForCruxSake
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Re: Am I a man or a woman?

Post by ForCruxSake » Wed Apr 26, 2017 8:21 pm

Harbal wrote:
ForCruxSake wrote: and only kick out at bullies, which you and Harbal show yourself to be, time and time again,
It sounds like you've had the same indoctrination they give to social workers.
So you have experience of social work? From which side of the service? As a worker or a 'client'?

Harbal wrote:Then, if someone dissents, the standard procedure is to stick a stigmatising label on them to shut them up. That's bullying.
I think you'll find I've addressed every comment and allegation made against me by VT. (I've largely ignored you as from quite early on only seem to want to attack me, not my ideas on a subject. I've not got time to deal with your need to troll.)

Back to her, her comments were noted (not just by me) as having a demeaning attitude, not just towards those want to safeguard other cultures, branded PC, but towards other cultures themselves. From the outset her comments were dodgy. She took a thread about gender identity and effectively turned into a rant about race

I'm not stigmatising somebody. I'm arguing with somebody whose logic is bent by hate. She comes across as racist not as a simple dissenter. Many people here are dissenters. I disagree with them without labelling them. They don't all do it by ranting the kind of rhetoric uttered by political racists. Or are you suggesting that the National Front and the BNP are simply dissenters? In which case, we shall have to have the grace to agree to disagree.
Harbal wrote:
ForCruxSake wrote: I call people racist HERE for refusing to accept other cultures HERE with grace
That's not exactly racism, is it?
It is when people are being discriminated against, or decried as usurping, jobs, culture, raising the crime statistics and blamed for whatever else, in others inability to accept them, with grace. I can only speak for my experience of this country, hence the HERE.

You should really cut and paste EVERYTHING I have written to make what I am saying clear rather than pulling a couple of sentences out of context from a short retort.

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Re: Am I a man or a woman?

Post by ForCruxSake » Wed Apr 26, 2017 8:25 pm

vegetariantaxidermy wrote:
ForCruxSake wrote:''I seek to live in peace, as pleasantly as possible with those around me, and only kick out at bullies''.
You really must stop spoiling me with all this irony.
PWA... This is getting very boring now, Nothing new Is being said. SO POINTLESS NOW. Rant on, baby. Shake your rattle, rock the pram. You have nothing left to say.
Last edited by ForCruxSake on Wed Apr 26, 2017 8:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Am I a man or a woman?

Post by ForCruxSake » Wed Apr 26, 2017 8:29 pm

Harbal wrote:
ForCruxSake wrote: In which case, they pay me well to bore them, and keep renegotiating my contract to stay, without breaking a yawn.
High flyers don't usually spend hours on end on internet forums, they typically have more important and interesting things to do.
How on earth would you know what a high flyer does? I have only to point at Trump, fool.

I never claimed to be a high flyer. I'm somebody who works to contract when it pleases me, and I get paid enough, to do so. That's what you and VT have in common: you make assumptions you continually graft meaning on to, without enquiring first.

You know nothing about me, nor about high flyers, by the looks of it, why waste your time spouting this nonsense? Because you are infected with hate, too, and have nothing of any worth to actually say? There are better enemies in the real world to be fighting than me.

Stick to talking about subjects you know about.

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vegetariantaxidermy
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Re: Am I a man or a woman?

Post by vegetariantaxidermy » Wed Apr 26, 2017 8:44 pm

ForCruxSake wrote:
Harbal wrote:
ForCruxSake wrote: In which case, they pay me well to bore them, and keep renegotiating my contract to stay, without breaking a yawn.
High flyers don't usually spend hours on end on internet forums, they typically have more important and interesting things to do.
How on earth would you know what a high flyer does? I have only to point at Trump, fool.

You know nothing about me nor about high flyers, by the looks of it, why waste your time spouting this nonsense?
You actually described yourself as a 'high flier'? :lol: I can see you as a 'high flier', but not in the way you think.
Even if I was a 'racist', it's irrelevant here. You can't box me quite that easily, and your lazy labeling won't silence me on here. People might be scared of 'SJW' free speech haters like you in the 'real' world, but for now your bullying little labeling system means squat on here. Btw, is it illegal to be a racist? I often think that the worst do-gooders are secretly rabid racists with a guilt complex, trying desperately to convince the world that they are 'good people'.
Why is it ok for you to rave on about 'different cultures' (but only if they are your particular pet ones)? So you can do it, but that's ok. Are you the thought police? Is that the 'high flying profession' you keep boasting about?
Last edited by vegetariantaxidermy on Wed Apr 26, 2017 8:52 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Am I a man or a woman?

Post by Harbal » Wed Apr 26, 2017 8:45 pm

ForCruxSake wrote: So you have experience of social work? From which side of the service? As a worker or a 'client'?
Neither, just an acquaintance, not a friend. He's above average intelligence which makes it all the more puzzling how he can, at the same time, be so stupid. I suspect this is typical of most social workers.

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Re: Am I a man or a woman?

Post by Harbal » Wed Apr 26, 2017 8:48 pm

ForCruxSake wrote: How on earth would you know what a high flyer does?
I don't know what a high flyer does but I've got a pretty good idea of what they don't do.

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Re: Am I a man or a woman?

Post by ForCruxSake » Wed Apr 26, 2017 9:11 pm

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: You actually described yourself as a 'high flier'? :lol:
No I didn't. I made a simple statement about working to contract, which I get to renogiate to my advantage, the more my services are needed. Based on that Harbal, and now you, are making that assumption and attributing it to me.

But hell, nothing wrong in being a high flyer! So, thank you. :)
Vegitariantaxidermy wrote:Even if I was a 'racist', it's irrelevant here. You can't box me quite that easily little fascist SJW, and your lazy labeling won't silence me on here. People might be scared of fascists like you in the 'real' world, but for now your bullying little labeling system means squat on here. Btw, is it illegal to be a racist? I often think that the worst do-gooders are secretly rabid racists with a guilt complex, trying desperately to convince the world that they are 'good people'.
Why is it ok for you to rave on about 'different cultures' (but only if they are your particular pet ones)? So you can do it, but that's ok. Are you the thought police? Is that the 'high flying profession' you keep boasting about?
You think I would share every detail of my life with people like you? I'm not as stupid as you! You've done little to earn any kind of trust. You're just hating trolls that scrape up every little detail about people that comes up, to fashion into bullets you fire back at them. You don't hurt me with what I say because you're not given enough information to actually dig at me. You fail to ask to questions , to produce a fuller picture, preferring to take what little you know and act as if you have a fuller picture... and then it's put to such poor use. Ridicule? No. It just makes it easy to point out how assumptive, peevish and petty you are.

And the rest of it....PWA... Pugnacious, whiny, adding nothing to the subject of the thread (or any sub-threads). Boring and repetitive. Yawn, zzzzzzzzzz

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Re: Am I a man or a woman?

Post by Harbal » Wed Apr 26, 2017 9:19 pm

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Re: Am I a man or a woman?

Post by ForCruxSake » Wed Apr 26, 2017 10:29 pm

Harbal wrote:
ForCruxSake wrote: How on earth would you know what a high flyer does?
I don't know what a high flyer does but I've got a pretty good idea of what they don't do.
I didn't say I was a high flyer, and if you are continuing to suggest that I think I am. I don't. You are the one that is pushing that boat out.

Your statement about what you think high flyers do, or don't, do has already been challenged with one word: Trump.

You know very little about me or high flyers. At the risk of repeating myself, stick to talking about what you do know. No one wants to see you showing off your ignorance. Not even me.

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Re: Am I a man or a woman?

Post by Harbal » Wed Apr 26, 2017 10:35 pm

ForCruxSake wrote: stick to talking about what you do know.
There wouldn't be any point in me coming If I did that.

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Re: Am I a man or a woman?

Post by vegetariantaxidermy » Wed Apr 26, 2017 10:51 pm

Harbal wrote:
ForCruxSake wrote: stick to talking about what you do know.
There wouldn't be any point in me coming If I did that.
Do you think she's a Trump fan? Why does she keep bringing him up?

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Re: Am I a man or a woman?

Post by Harbal » Wed Apr 26, 2017 11:05 pm

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: Do you think she's a Trump fan?
I think she's aching to say what she is but no one will ask her.

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Re: Re:

Post by Arising_uk » Wed Apr 26, 2017 11:13 pm

vegetariantaxidermy wrote:Never seen the Daily Mail. ...
You should, as you could write for them.
Ok then. I'm sure crime hasn't increased at all over there, and a young man wasn't beheaded in the street, Pakistani rape gangs don't exist, and it's all a joyful 'melting pot of rainbowness'. ...
Who said any of this? You love your hyperbole don't you.
I suppose John Cleese must read the Dail Mail. ...
What's that tax-dodging ex-pat got to do with anything?
I notice you didn't include 'Eastern Europeans' in your little Utopian dream. :wink:
Did you, so what? As by and large they're just here to work and only some will be staying.
And who said I was only talking about England anyway? Why would I care what happens over there?
Then stop yakking on about how it is over here then and stick with your country.
There's nothing wrong with immigration in numbers that are small enough to be absorbed. But it's hardly fair when it ends up swamping out the host inhabitants, stretching infrastructure to breaking point, taking most of the jobs, and becoming the dominant culture or cultures. ...
Where's this happening then, your country? As if you add together all the non-whites in mine you come up with about 13% of the population so hardly swamped. If areas are straining to provide services it's because of govt not paying for them as those who are here are working and paying taxes so the issue is with the austerity policies not with those who work.
And all because Govts. want to create an artificially high GDP thus making it look as if the economy is 'healthy and growing' and the Govt. is doing a 'great job', when in fact wages have been forced continually down and home ownership forced up and out of reach for people who are now second class citizens in their own country by rich immigrants who aren't interested in assimilating--only laundering their money. ...
They are not immigrants who are doing that in the cities in my country, they are the wealthy of other nations looking to make a buck from our lax capital gains tax laws. Given we have a minimum-income system over here that the wages cannot be forced down past it appears that the immigrants are doing the jobs the indigenous don't want to do. what are you, some kind of communist?
It has NOTHING to do with 'ending racism'. Why the fuck would you need to 'end racism' where it barely existed in the first place? But it sure does now. ...
I can only assume you are young or live in a racial paradise as over here in my youth racism was rampant and overt, still can hear the chants, "Oh I'd rather bash a paki than a black..." and "There ain't no black in the Union Jack", etc, etc.
And it's hardly 'racism' to object to short-sighted, self-serving and destructive Govt. policy. Oh, how racist of the English to object to German invaders. Just because it's been done legally doesn't mean the end result isn't the same. What if the Govt. had just rolled over and welcomed the Germans? No doubt the English would have simply shrugged and smiled and welcomed them with open arms (to do otherwise would be 'racist!').
You mean like when the British construction worker went to Germany in the 80's and took all their jobs?

You really think that if we remove all the non-uk workers doing pretty much all the shit-jobs the white Briton will be queuing to replace them? That they'll be willing to get up at five in the morning to do the back-breaking farm work, clean the toilets and wards, serve the food, etc.

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Re: Re:

Post by Harbal » Wed Apr 26, 2017 11:20 pm

Arising_uk wrote:You mean like when the British construction worker went to Germany in the 80's and took all their jobs?
It must have been exhausting for him.

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