Race versus culture

Abortion, euthanasia, genetic engineering, Just War theory and other such hot topics.

Moderators: AMod, iMod

Locked
Belinda
Posts: 8034
Joined: Fri Aug 26, 2016 10:13 am

Re: Race versus culture

Post by Belinda »

Seleucus wrote: Wed Nov 15, 2017 3:39 am
Hobbes' Choice wrote: Wed Nov 15, 2017 12:03 amFuck off you stupid racist ****.
It's hard to be a genius when you are in chains you fucking moron.
Extensive research and arguments of both sides of this debate. Requires considerable endurance and erudition to be able to say something meaningful on this.
It's hard to be a genius when you are in chains
Okay Seleucus?
User avatar
Arising_uk
Posts: 12314
Joined: Wed Oct 17, 2007 2:31 am

Re: Race versus culture

Post by Arising_uk »

Seleucus wrote:... Caucasianess is an expression of Western culture.
:lol: Or in other words you have to be white to be able to join in, and you say you aren't punting the white supremacist neo-nazi agenda.
User avatar
Seleucus
Posts: 662
Joined: Sat May 06, 2017 3:53 am

Re: Race versus culture

Post by Seleucus »

Arising_uk wrote: Wed Nov 15, 2017 2:47 pm
Seleucus wrote:... Caucasianess is an expression of Western culture.
:lol: Or in other words you have to be white to be able to join in, and you say you aren't punting the white supremacist neo-nazi agenda.
I'm not expressing any support for anything, I'm explaining that for Barth, culture isn't the expression of a race as the typical racist would have it, instead, he sees it oppositely, race is the expression of culture instead.
User avatar
Arising_uk
Posts: 12314
Joined: Wed Oct 17, 2007 2:31 am

Re: Race versus culture

Post by Arising_uk »

Seleucus wrote:I'm not expressing any support for anything, I'm explaining that for Barth, culture isn't the expression of a race as the typical racist would have it, instead, he sees it oppositely, race is the expression of culture instead.
So no problem just changing the culture to include various races then.
Belinda
Posts: 8034
Joined: Fri Aug 26, 2016 10:13 am

Re: Race versus culture

Post by Belinda »

Seleucus wrote:
race is the expression of culture
It is one way in which some particular of culture of belief is expressed. 'Race' is important for devotees of racist cultures of belief. I put startle marks around 'race' because racists often have unscientific and anti-historical beliefs about race. People whose cultures of belief stress the significance of 'race' are basically frightened people who feel threatened by those who are perceived to be different from themselves. Fear of difference arises from poverty or some other actual threat of danger which causes people to demonise an outgroup. (Jews, gypsies, witches, immigrants, 'savages')

The demonising of an outgroup is a useful strategy for a would-be political dictator who seeks to gain power for self or for his elite group.
User avatar
GreatandWiseTrixie
Posts: 1547
Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2015 9:51 pm

Re: Race versus culture

Post by GreatandWiseTrixie »

Everyone here is talking nonsense.

Seleceus, I hope you are being sarcastic because, race is actually not an expression of culture. You are stuck at whatever race you are born as. You are stuck at whatever body you are born as. If you are born male, you will experience rejection from women and likely you will fight as a soldier overseas. If you are born female, you will be able to choose to date whoever you please. If you are born black, you will likely be obsessed with atheletics, nike and be able to get laid more than a white person. If you are born white, you will likely be angsty, anti-social, nerdy and have a tough time with intimacy. These are all genetic qualities of race. Even liberals are aware of this, that is why whenever they claim blacks are the superior race, they always resort to talking about their physical athleticism. And liberals will always advertise blacks in Sports/atheletes commercials.

The whole idea of modern liberalism is that, awareness of the Ghost in the shell. That some blacks, do not live up to their expectations. That if a black is a geniune nerd, and wants to be a nerd, he will be rejected by the rest of the blacks, and so he should be accepted by other societies, such as the white society. People hate racists because, racist stick only to roles and genetics, and if someone wants to play a role outside of their genetics, racists stick them into the same society they came from. Essentially, to hate a racist, you must be yourself a racist. Because the whole idea of hating segregation, means that you inherently think black society is inferior to white society, and that it is an injustice/cruel to force blacks to live with other blacks.
User avatar
Seleucus
Posts: 662
Joined: Sat May 06, 2017 3:53 am

Re: Race versus culture

Post by Seleucus »

GreatandWiseTrixie wrote: Fri Nov 17, 2017 2:50 pm Everyone here is talking nonsense.

Seleceus, I hope you are being sarcastic because, race is actually not an expression of culture.
You can scroll back up to my review of Barth's article.
You are stuck at whatever race you are born as. You are stuck at whatever body you are born as.
I don't think Barth is necessarily disputing that. What he's saying is when you think of Oriental culture you think of chop sticks, rice, scraggly pine trees -- and -- slanted eyes, stumpy feet, and black hair. So the racial qualities are aspects of the culture. This makes it rather difficult for people who don't have squinty eyes to truly become Orientals. And conversely...
These are all genetic qualities of race.
Maybe they are, maybe they aren't. I don't have an opinion either way. I lean towards expecting that culture is sufficient to explain those habits you mentioned but I'm willing to agree that genetics probably influences character also.
Even liberals are aware of this, that is why whenever they claim blacks are the superior race, they always resort to talking about their physical athleticism. And liberals will always advertise blacks in Sports/atheletes commercials.
Then why are Black people so bad at swimming and hockey and gymnastics and skiing and beach volleyball and kayaking and rock climbing and cycling and fencing and lacrosse and equestrian and archery and ping pong and...?
User avatar
Seleucus
Posts: 662
Joined: Sat May 06, 2017 3:53 am

Re: Race versus culture

Post by Seleucus »

Belinda wrote: Fri Nov 17, 2017 12:19 pm Seleucus wrote:
race is the expression of culture
People whose cultures of belief stress the significance of 'race' are basically frightened people who feel threatened by those who are perceived to be different from themselves. Fear of difference arises from poverty or some other actual threat of danger which causes people to demonise an outgroup. (Jews, gypsies, witches, immigrants, 'savages')
It's hard to put one's finger on why the Latins didn't embrace the landing Saracens with love but were instead "frightened people who feel threatened" and began "to demonise an outgroup". Just a wild hunch... Maybe millennia of invasions and war and rape...?
The demonising of an outgroup is a useful strategy for a would-be political dictator who seeks to gain power for self or for his elite group.
I don't believe Barth is making any comment on whether ethnogenesis is the demonizing of others, but instead is proposing that all identity is formed in opposition to an other. That's probably more of a spiritual point, like, the separation and all that...

"Into eternity, where all is one, there crept a tiny, mad idea..." [T-27.VIII.6:2-3]
http://www.god-jesus-course-in-miracles ... d-idea.htm
User avatar
Seleucus
Posts: 662
Joined: Sat May 06, 2017 3:53 am

Re: Race versus culture

Post by Seleucus »

Arising_uk wrote: Fri Nov 17, 2017 11:42 am
Seleucus wrote:I'm not expressing any support for anything, I'm explaining that for Barth, culture isn't the expression of a race as the typical racist would have it, instead, he sees it oppositely, race is the expression of culture instead.
So no problem just changing the culture to include various races then.
Haven't we spent about four weeks discussing how culture is highly resistant to change, therefore "just changing" is probably not so easily affected...
User avatar
GreatandWiseTrixie
Posts: 1547
Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2015 9:51 pm

Re: Race versus culture

Post by GreatandWiseTrixie »

Seleucus wrote: Fri Nov 17, 2017 3:09 pm
Even liberals are aware of this, that is why whenever they claim blacks are the superior race, they always resort to talking about their physical athleticism. And liberals will always advertise blacks in Sports/atheletes commercials.
Then why are Black people so bad at swimming and hockey and gymnastics and skiing and beach volleyball and kayaking and rock climbing and cycling and fencing and lacrosse and equestrian and archery and ping pong and...?
Those are all white sports, most of them are not on free TV. But in Kayaking and Hockey commercials, they usually advertise whites.

I'm not saying that whites are never advertised in sports. I'm saying you never see blacks advertised in something like, a nerdy computer commercial, by these so called liberals of equality.
User avatar
Seleucus
Posts: 662
Joined: Sat May 06, 2017 3:53 am

Re: Race versus culture

Post by Seleucus »

GreatandWiseTrixie wrote: Fri Nov 17, 2017 3:30 pm
Seleucus wrote: Fri Nov 17, 2017 3:09 pm
Even liberals are aware of this, that is why whenever they claim blacks are the superior race, they always resort to talking about their physical athleticism. And liberals will always advertise blacks in Sports/atheletes commercials.
Then why are Black people so bad at swimming and hockey and gymnastics and skiing and beach volleyball and kayaking and rock climbing and cycling and fencing and lacrosse and equestrian and archery and ping pong and...?
Those are all white sports, most of them are not on free TV. But in Kayaking and Hockey commercials, they usually advertise whites.

I'm not saying that whites are never advertised in sports. I'm saying you never see blacks advertised in something like, a nerdy computer commercial, by these so called liberals of equality.
Mhm... So maybe it might not be that Blacks are so much genetically physically superior (something which is quite obvious if you've ever been in Africa), but instead there might be a cultural element to Blacks being so good at slam dunking, but not quite so good with Judo or Taekwondo or Karate or Greco-Roman wrestling either... Anyway, I'm willing to agree races have genetic differences of significance if it pleases you so I'm not going to entrench on this position.
User avatar
GreatandWiseTrixie
Posts: 1547
Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2015 9:51 pm

Re: Race versus culture

Post by GreatandWiseTrixie »

Seleucus wrote: Fri Nov 17, 2017 3:35 pm Mhm... So maybe it might not be that Blacks are so much genetically physically superior (something which is quite obvious if you've ever been in Africa), but instead there might be a cultural element to Blacks being so good at slam dunking, but not quite so good with Judo or Taekwondo or Karate or Greco-Roman wrestling either... Anyway, I'm willing to agree races have genetic differences of significance if it pleases you so I'm not going to entrench on this position.
I never said blacks were better at all athletics than whites. All I said was that blacks were more mentally obsessed with athletics/sports than whites.
Black "heroes" are sport legends. Most black people don't even know who George Washington Carver even is.
User avatar
GreatandWiseTrixie
Posts: 1547
Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2015 9:51 pm

Re: Race versus culture

Post by GreatandWiseTrixie »

Seleucus wrote: Fri Nov 17, 2017 3:35 pm Mhm... So maybe it might not be that Blacks are so much genetically physically superior (something which is quite obvious if you've ever been in Africa), but instead there might be a cultural element to Blacks being so good at slam dunking, but not quite so good with Judo or Taekwondo or Karate or Greco-Roman wrestling either... Anyway, I'm willing to agree races have genetic differences of significance if it pleases you so I'm not going to entrench on this position.
I would say, blacks obsession with shoes is embedded in their DNA. They love Air jordans and Nikes because those are the male hunting techniques. Black africans main hunting technique is, outrunning their prey on foot, for several miles.
User avatar
Seleucus
Posts: 662
Joined: Sat May 06, 2017 3:53 am

Re: Race versus culture

Post by Seleucus »

GreatandWiseTrixie wrote: Fri Nov 17, 2017 3:51 pm
Seleucus wrote: Fri Nov 17, 2017 3:35 pm Mhm... So maybe it might not be that Blacks are so much genetically physically superior (something which is quite obvious if you've ever been in Africa), but instead there might be a cultural element to Blacks being so good at slam dunking, but not quite so good with Judo or Taekwondo or Karate or Greco-Roman wrestling either... Anyway, I'm willing to agree races have genetic differences of significance if it pleases you so I'm not going to entrench on this position.
I would say, blacks obsession with shoes is embedded in their DNA. They love Air jordans and Nikes because those are the male hunting techniques. Black africans main hunting technique is, outrunning their prey on foot, for several miles.
I suppose Blacks were pretty much the worst hunters given that humans hunted the megafauna to extinction on pretty much every continent except Africa.
User avatar
GreatandWiseTrixie
Posts: 1547
Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2015 9:51 pm

Re: Race versus culture

Post by GreatandWiseTrixie »

Seleucus wrote: Fri Nov 17, 2017 3:57 pm
GreatandWiseTrixie wrote: Fri Nov 17, 2017 3:51 pm
Seleucus wrote: Fri Nov 17, 2017 3:35 pm Mhm... So maybe it might not be that Blacks are so much genetically physically superior (something which is quite obvious if you've ever been in Africa), but instead there might be a cultural element to Blacks being so good at slam dunking, but not quite so good with Judo or Taekwondo or Karate or Greco-Roman wrestling either... Anyway, I'm willing to agree races have genetic differences of significance if it pleases you so I'm not going to entrench on this position.
I would say, blacks obsession with shoes is embedded in their DNA. They love Air jordans and Nikes because those are the male hunting techniques. Black africans main hunting technique is, outrunning their prey on foot, for several miles.
I suppose Blacks were pretty much the worst hunters given that humans hunted the megafauna to extinction on pretty much every continent except Africa.
I'm still trying to figure out if Subsaharans invented the wheel. I really don't think they did, or else liberals would have made the information easier to find.
Locked