The Weeping Angel & the Birth of Philosophy...

Bill Wiltrack · **Posted:** Sun Sep 04, 2011 3:53 pm

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Bill Wiltrack · **Posted:** Thu Sep 08, 2011 5:17 pm

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Bill Wiltrack · **Posted:** Tue Sep 13, 2011 7:05 pm

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Arising_uk · **Joined:** Wed Oct 17, 2007 2:31 am **Posts:** 10396

Thundril · **Posted:** Tue Sep 13, 2011 9:24 pm

Bummer! I thought this thread was going to be about Dr Who.

John · **Posted:** Tue Sep 13, 2011 9:39 pm

Thundril wrote:

Bummer! I thought this thread was going to be about Dr Who.

It would be a lot more interesting if it was.

lancek4 · **Joined:** Sat Oct 16, 2010 5:50 pm **Posts:** 1565

Bill, you are one out-there mf. UC santa cruz has a 'History of Consciousnees' where noted Angela Davis was resident faculty. There was another professor who's name eludes me right now. Though she was a cultural critique person, you remind me of her. She would put out videos and I never knew quite what to make of them. They were so abstract and way out there. This was 10 years ago. Maybe I'd have a different take now.. But

I check out yer posts and topics and often I'm kinda at a loss where you are coming from unless its a 'aphilosophical' zen kind of thing.
I'm not sure what your pictures have to do with the birth of philosophy. Possibly Socrates' deamon? Or some pure poetic expression? Please enlighten me/ us.

Bill Wiltrack · **Posted:** Wed Sep 14, 2011 3:18 pm

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(John 20:13) - "And they *said to her, "Woman why are you weeping?" She *said to them, "Because they have taken away my Lord, and I do not know where they have laid Him."

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Thundril · **Posted:** Wed Sep 14, 2011 3:59 pm

And remember, - don't blink!

lancek4 · **Joined:** Sat Oct 16, 2010 5:50 pm **Posts:** 1565

[quote="Bill Wiltrack"].

(John 20:13) - "And they *said to her, "Woman why are you weeping?" She *said to them, "Because they have taken away my Lord, and I do not know where they have laid Him."

.[/q good thank you I agree. Now what else ? Is that the end between us. ? Do we then aim toward others?

lancek4 · **Joined:** Sat Oct 16, 2010 5:50 pm **Posts:** 1565

Can this move be an end result? What is next? Indeed, try to get people up to speed, but then - what? Bask in th glory of presumptuousness?
Can we discuss this 'beginning of philosophy' that I and otherss have attempted to indicate with 'aphilosphy' and by other means?
Once we have gotten to this understanding, is that where discourse ends?
Are we communicating?

Bill Wiltrack · **Posted:** Thu Sep 15, 2011 12:05 am

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YES! First we must aim toward others and infuse them with our ideas!
We can move to take over the world as an end result!

Next we will try to get people up to speed, but then - what? Bask in th glory of presumptuousness!

We can we discuss this 'beginning of philosophy' that I and otherss have attempted to indicate with 'aphilosphy' and by other means.

Once we have gotten to this understanding, that where discourse ends.
Do you get it? Are we communicating?

Bring this to the world for me.

And for this...I will make you Lieutenant!

um.

ahh

okay, hold on a minute...

that's wrong.

Sorry about that.

This is what I wanted to say:

I think in this quote, (John 20:13) - "And they *said to her, "Woman why are you weeping?" She *said to them, "Because they have taken away my Lord, and I do not know where they have laid Him."

I think "Because they have taken away my Lord, and I do not know where they have laid Him." was reportedly spoken by Mary or more correctly, Miriam. She was looking for Jesus' dead body in the cavernous tomb past the Gates of Gennath. She thought thieves had taken the body of Christ. Hopelessness. Utter hopelessness and despair. The ultimate pain of loneliness and loss.

I needed to use the quote in a universal manner, so the quote could relate to all of us.

I believe the seed of philosophy is borne within us through pain. Emotional pain.

The quote above reflects the hopelessness that I believe is necessary. Emotional pain is a payment of sorts. A Dark Night of the Soul.

That. Through anguish. That is where real philosophy is rooted. That is the soil that is necessary for a love of philosophical thought blooms.

I wanted to keep the thread artistic for as long as possible and it worked out perfectly in that respect.

Miriam didn't know it but Jesus was actually talking to her when she heard the voice within the tomb say, "Woman why are you weeping?"

Then he revealed himself to her. After her despair, her utter and total despair. He said, Hey, I'm here. I'm right here.

That too feels like a characteristic of a life in philosophy.

Total anguish and utter despair – and then enlightenment!

We move forward. We break a barrier. We are forever changed.

As for The Weeping Angel, well, The Weeping Angel has never really been defined. It seems like an image we can all impose emotions on. We can all interpret what The Weeping Angel signifies and each of us will be correct.

I wanted everyone who read this thread to wonder. To think. To question and not be able to obtain a definitive answer. In that respect I think the thread has already work beyond my wildest expectations. In that respect the thread has worked as an artistic mechanism. This thread as purely art.

I really enjoyed this thread. I really grew but it was only possible because of the associated comments.

Individually and as a collective image The Weeping Angel & the Birth of Philosophy... works.

I thank everyone who has participated.

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Arising_uk · **Joined:** Wed Oct 17, 2007 2:31 am **Posts:** 10396

Don't be scared, they're not hard and if you answer them it may help you with your emotional anguish and pain.

"What would becoming the truth do for you?"

"What would becoming the truth be for you?"

"What truth is it that you have begun with?"

Arising_uk · **Joined:** Wed Oct 17, 2007 2:31 am **Posts:** 10396

Bill Wiltrack wrote:

... I wanted everyone who read this thread to wonder. To think. To question and not be able to obtain a definitive answer. In that respect I think the thread has already work beyond my wildest expectations. In that respect the thread has worked as an artistic mechanism. This thread as purely art. ...

Other peoples as usual but fear not as all your threads make us wonder and you never give answers so nothing new there.

Quote:

I really enjoyed this thread. I really grew but it was only possible because of the associated comments.

Me...me...me...me...me...is what its all about with you is it not.

Quote:

I thank everyone who has participated.

That'll be just about you then.

lancek4 · **Joined:** Sat Oct 16, 2010 5:50 pm **Posts:** 1565

Bill Wiltrack wrote:

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YES! First we must aim toward others and infuse them with our ideas!
Is that not the presumption that is denied in discusssion: to 'argue' buut then to convince. What does this cconvincing?
We can move to take over the world as an end result!

Next we will try to get people up to speed, but then - what? Bask in th glory of presumptuousness!

We can we discuss this 'beginning of philosophy' that I and otherss have attempted to indicate with 'aphilosphy' and by other means.
It is interesting that your beginning of philsophy is different from mine. I return to my past earlier: I have no idea what you are talking about.

Once we have gotten to this understanding, that where discourse ends.
Do you get it? Are we communicating?
of course we are not.

Bring this to the world for me.
And for this...I will make you Lieutenant!
um.
ahh
okay, hold on a minute...
that's wrong.
Sorry about that.

This is what I wanted to say:

I think in this quote, (John 20:13) - "And they *said to her, "Woman why are you weeping?" She *said to them, "Because they have taken away my Lord, and I do not know where they have laid Him."

I think "Because they have taken away my Lord, and I do not know where they have laid Him." was reportedly spoken by Mary or more correctly, Miriam. She was looking for Jesus' dead body in the cavernous tomb past the Gates of Gennath. She thought thieves had taken the body of Christ. Hopelessness. Utter hopelessness and despair. The ultimate pain of loneliness and loss.

Yes; And, I would think that she was weeping because that which could save her she thought had been lost. As if the material of the physical man was what was needed to save her. And indeed, she found that in her despair that which indeed was her redemption was found to return.

I needed to use the quote in a universal manner, so the quote could relate to all of us.

I believe the seed of philosophy is borne within us through pain. Emotional pain.
But perhaps not just a particular emotional trial, but an experience that is despair.

The quote above reflects the hopelessness that I believe is necessary. Emotional pain is a payment of sorts. A Dark Night of the Soul.

That. Through anguish. That is where real philosophy is rooted. That is the soil that is necessary for a love of philosophical thought blooms.
So, I cannot help but ask: in what way does this 'real', 'beginning of' philsophy manifest? Is it something that we can speak about?

I wanted to keep the thread artistic for as long as possible and it worked out perfectly in that respect.

Miriam didn't know it but Jesus was actually talking to her when she heard the voice within the tomb say, "Woman why are you weeping?"
"And Jesus [the poetic personification of this experience], walking by the sea of Galilee, saw two bretheren... casting thier net into the sea...And he said to them: 'follow me, and I will make you fishers of men'".

Then he revealed himself to her. After her despair, her utter and total despair. He said, Hey, I'm here. I'm right here.

That too feels like a characteristic of a life in philosophy.
HOw does one attain such despair? How am I to know what you are saying if I have not reached that ppoint of utter despair? Are you doomed to speak into the void because noone else has had such despair?

Total anguish and utter despair – and then enlightenment!
Can this be created? Can an individual bring it on himself so that he may 'begin' philsophy?

We move forward. We break a barrier. We are forever changed.

As for The Weeping Angel, well, The Weeping Angel has never really been defined. It seems like an image we can all impose emotions on. We can all interpret what The Weeping Angel signifies and each of us will be correct.

I wanted everyone who read this thread to wonder. I did wonder. To think. I did think. thank you. But then I asked if You could tell us what Your position might be. To question and not be able to obtain a definitive answer. In that respect I think the thread has already work beyond my wildest expectations. In that respect the thread has worked as an artistic mechanism. This thread as purely art.

Very good . But I found a definitive answer by us not communicating. How can that be?

I really enjoyed this thread. I really grew but it was only possible because of the associated comments.

Individually and as a collective image The Weeping Angel & the Birth of Philosophy... works.
So this is the same as "Truth Is"? All is relative. Every human expression is equally valid. All interpretation equally true. Then how is it that philsophy began anywhere?

So I am still asking: have you taken too much LSD or meth and just scatter images and ethereal phrases around because you do have some central meaning but are somehow able to see how your methods are ineffective to convey it and so you stay comfortably hidden behind the 'mysterium'?

I thank everyone who has participated. Sure thats great. I enjoy such things, it is interesting. But im sorry, how I view philsophy is not a variable definition based on whatever anyone wishes to inject under the term 'philosophy'.

I am somewhat disappointed that you appear to hide behind a veil and motions of slight-of-hand in a presumptuous insiuation that you are so witty and philosophically enlightened.

Such a person reveals that he has no courage such as you posted earler, is not brave, but is indeed afraid to show himself. Reveals himself as hardly the person he wishes to represent.

and upon thinking, I can see how you are in despair.

Ok so now I know to let your posts go with a wink and a nod and a pat on the back.
Thank you for your artistic self. Art is good. You an Typist can go smoke a joint together and express, express, express.

this has helped. thank you for your participation.

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