Einstein and the Cosmic Man

[Arising_uk]

A_uk

Anamnesis or remembrance Plato refers to is a priori knowledge or knowledge we are born with. ...

Then stop using that quote as it does not apply to such an idea.

If we are born with it then why do we need to remember it and if it is a priori knowledge then why does it need to be remembered as it'll be self-evident?
If it is a priori then you are talking about the propositions of Logic and as such about Reason and reasoning which I do think Plato would be interested in, what I don't think it is about is your metaphysical theology.

It is also the foundation for intuition. The contradiction which inspires intuition invites a higher quality of understanding which is remembered

What contradiction?

I am referring to the quality of an educational environment which opens the mind and the heart to experience that which is greater than oneself and invites the pursuit of a higher cosmic perspective. You write of religious studies. We are speaking of different things

We sure are, as what you want to do is to indoctrinate the kids into your metaphysical theology as against what is being done which is to introduce them to the idea that there is more than one religion and allow them to contemplate such a fact. You appear to have ignored that Philosophy is coming back to our schools(at least over here) and there we can introduce metaphysics, ethics and moral reasoning for the kids to contemplate.

[Belinda]

Nick_A wrote:

I am referring to the quality of an educational environment which opens the mind and the heart to experience that which is greater than oneself and invites the pursuit of a higher cosmic perspective. You write of religious studies. We are speaking of different things

But the study of man's religious quest as history of ideas is only one way to do religious studies. The other way, which is close to what you desire is to study religions as ways to understand how men live and should live. Besides traditional religious material, such as The Bible, there is much other quality literature as novels, plays ,and poems which

"opens the mind and the heart to experience that which is greater than oneself and invites the pursuit of a higher cosmic perspective."

[Nick_A]

Nick_A wrote:

I am referring to the quality of an educational environment which opens the mind and the heart to experience that which is greater than oneself and invites the pursuit of a higher cosmic perspective. You write of religious studies. We are speaking of different things

But the study of man's religious quest as history of ideas is only one way to do religious studies. The other way, which is close to what you desire is to study religions as ways to understand how men live and should live. Besides traditional religious material, such as The Bible, there is much other quality literature as novels, plays ,and poems which

"opens the mind and the heart to experience that which is greater than oneself and invites the pursuit of a higher cosmic perspective."

You are too much. You asked for an explanation of my educational philosophy and ignore it when I explain it.

[Harbal]

You asked for an explanation of my educational philosophy and ignore it when I explain it.

You may as well get used to that, Nick, it's going to happen a lot.

[Belinda]

Nick complained to me:

You asked for an explanation of my educational philosophy and ignore it when I explain it.

I asked you to explain your curriculum and teaching method. You still have not done so.
I will stop asking you to explain your curriculum and teaching method, because you cannot do so.

[Nick_A]

Nick complained to me:

You asked for an explanation of my educational philosophy and ignore it when I explain it.

I asked you to explain your curriculum and teaching method. You still have not done so.
I will stop asking you to explain your curriculum and teaching method, because you cannot do so.

One cannot have a curriculm until one defines a goal. I did so for you here :

Re: Einstein and the Cosmic Man
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Post by Nick_A » Mon Oct 09, 2017 3:06 pm

If you deny it it is one thing but don't say I didn't offer it.

[Belinda]

Nick complained to me:

You asked for an explanation of my educational philosophy and ignore it when I explain it.

I asked you to explain your curriculum and teaching method. You still have not done so.
I will stop asking you to explain your curriculum and teaching method, because you cannot do so.

One cannot have a curriculm until one defines a goal. I did so for you here :

Re: Einstein and the Cosmic Man
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Post by Nick_A » Mon Oct 09, 2017 3:06 pm

If you deny it it is one thing but don't say I didn't offer it.

A goal, Nick, is necessary but not sufficient. Your apparent goal is particularly suspect because you seem to be promoting some sort of religious indoctrination. If you had been able to describe your curriculum and method you might possibly have saved your bacon, iff these had been acceptable as education not indoctrination. But you cannot explain.

[Nick_A]

Nick complained to me:



I asked you to explain your curriculum and teaching method. You still have not done so.
I will stop asking you to explain your curriculum and teaching method, because you cannot do so.

One cannot have a curriculm until one defines a goal. I did so for you here :

Re: Einstein and the Cosmic Man
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Post by Nick_A » Mon Oct 09, 2017 3:06 pm

If you deny it it is one thing but don't say I didn't offer it.

A goal, Nick, is necessary but not sufficient. Your apparent goal is particularly suspect because you seem to be promoting some sort of religious indoctrination. If you had been able to describe your curriculum and method you might possibly have saved your bacon, iff these had been acceptable as education not indoctrination. But you cannot explain.

All you have shown is that your goal of secular indoctrination prevents you from recognizing the essential psychological potential for mind opening leading to experiencing the results of intuition which should be the fundamental goal of education. Selective facts leading to secular indoctrination is the goal of a secular education. Developing the conscious potential to experience the wholeness of the external world is the goal of a human education.

A human education enables a student to place facts within an experienced human perspective. A secular progressive education uses selective facts and negative attitudes to create an indoctrinated cave perspective.

The mind maturing towards opening to the higher intellect of intuition will be normal for a human education and rejected by the secular progressive advocates who consider it "religious."

[Arising_uk]

...
The mind maturing towards opening to the higher intellect of intuition will be normal for a human education and rejected by the secular progressive advocates who consider it "religious."

Still hearing a big fat nothing about what you will actually be teaching the young? Apart from a vague wave towards what would have once been called a classical or progressive liberal arts and science education.

[Nick_A]

...
The mind maturing towards opening to the higher intellect of intuition will be normal for a human education and rejected by the secular progressive advocates who consider it "religious."

Still hearing a big fat nothing about what you will actually be teaching the young? Apart from a vague wave towards what would have once been called a classical or progressive liberal arts and science education.

This is what is so disturbing. Neither you or Belinda will have the slightest idea what Einstein is referring to. You insist on teaching where Einstein provides the conditions in which learning becomes possible as opposed to secular indoctrination.

Fortunately there is still a minority who do understand and recognize the value of Einstein's observation and offer the alternative to spirit killing. They know that teaching what it means to be human isn't indoctrination but the skill of making learning possible

Einstein wrote:

“I never teach my pupils, I only attempt to provide the conditions in which they can learn.”

[Arising_uk]

This is what is so disturbing. Neither you or Belinda will have the slightest idea what Einstein is referring to. You insist on teaching where Einstein provides the conditions in which learning becomes possible as opposed to secular indoctrination. ...

I completely understand what Einstein was referring to and you patently don't. Does it not puzzle you that he spent his life teaching?

Fortunately there is still a minority who do understand and recognize the value of Einstein's observation and offer the alternative to spirit killing. They know that teaching what it means to be human isn't indoctrination but the skill of making learning possible

Still not hearing what you actually propose by this?

Einstein wrote:

“I never teach my pupils, I only attempt to provide the conditions in which they can learn.”

And what do you think the conditions to learn Physics are?

[Nick_A]

A_uk

And what do you think the conditions to learn Physics are?

There is human education and scientific education. The cosmic man refers to the results of a human education – a higher more inclusive quality of consciousness as opposed to the normal cave perspective that governs our lives. Inclusive consciousness reveals the big picture. Secular consciousness supports the small picture or cave life. Physics as is normally thought is just computer knowledge. It doesn't require a human education. It just requires the means to prove facts.

When science and in this case physics, serves the cosmic man or the big picture it is of service to man. When used by cave consciousness it is a mixed blessing. Man just as easily serves the results of physics including more efficient methods of killing.

Higher consciousness is the result of intuition rather than analysis and can lead to advances in physics. Consider Einstein’s discoveries:

https://drtism.com/2015/10/21/intuition ... and-plato/

Intuition always leads us, analysis follows its lead.

When Einstein conceived of the speed of light and Gravity, they were both understood intuitively first and the analysis was abstracted to make sense of his visions.
The more important the discovery, the more difficult it is for the analytical scientific method to confirm it. Einstein was in a rush to prove his general theory of relativity mathematically, after he understood it intuitively.
David Hilbert, perhaps the leading mathematician in the world was in a race with him to provide the equations to help prove his theory scientifically. Einstein won the race, though Hilbert’s contribution to Relativity was enormous.
Hilbert, through the use of set theory as devised by Georg Cantor, was able to conceive of a space that allowed for Einsteins space-time fabric. Einstein was not truly a specialist like Cantor and Hilbert were, he was a generalist, he saw the big picture and knew analysis well enough to imagine the universe as no other could before him.
Einstein said, if the equations don’t work, change the equations to account for what is (paraphrase), and by this he meant that intuition leads analysis, not that analysis itself was not important. Hilbert and other Formalists, had to reach back to Plato and his philosophy to retrieve a construct that allowed for the study of the tiny constituents of relativity and quantum mechanics.
What had been considered abstract objects, became real objects by employing Platos Forms, and we found equations that allowed for what we could never otherwise possibly study.

Einstein had a natural inclination to the big picture that appears through intuition and for him it led analysis.

What sense is it to write of curriculum if you deny the value of developing intuition and what is necessary to inspire it in the young? You and Belinda would prefer just to kill the natural impulse of objective intuition because it is “religious.” As I’ve said so many times, this is spirit killing and the attempt to create metaphysical repression in the young to further a secular agenda. Real child abuse.

[Belinda]

Nick wrote:

You and Belinda would prefer just to kill the natural impulse of objective intuition because it is “religious.” As I’ve said so many times,

Indeed you have Nick.

[marjoram_blues]

Nick wrote:

You and Belinda would prefer just to kill the natural impulse of objective intuition because it is “religious.” As I’ve said so many times,

Indeed you have Nick.

Belinda, I've kept out of this thread after taking advice from AMod, following N's abuse towards Greta and myself. I will not engage with him further. However, as you point out - as have others like Dubious, this thread is basically a continuation of the two 'Secular Intolerance' threads.
I think Amod deleted one, and locked the other after about 80 pages.

So, now this thread has reached 30 pages.
I am sorry that you left out the remainder of his penultimate sentence in the above quote. Together with his 'Real child abuse', linking Arising, you and anyone else who disagrees with him as either 'brainwashed snowflakes' or 'spirit killers' - this is unacceptable in a PN forum.

This toxicity and continual personal abuse to others should not be allowed to continue.
However, at one point, AMod said he did not see anything wrong with his posts.
Looks like N is taking advantage of this, and the general tolerance here.
I expect more of the same...might well reach 90 pages or more....
And then another thread...

[Nick_A]

Nick wrote:

You and Belinda would prefer just to kill the natural impulse of objective intuition because it is “religious.” As I’ve said so many times,

Indeed you have Nick.

Belinda, I've kept out of this thread after taking advice from AMod, following N's abuse towards Greta and myself. I will not engage with him further. However, as you point out - as have others like Dubious, this thread is basically a continuation of the two 'Secular Intolerance' threads.
I think Amod deleted one, and locked the other after about 80 pages.

So, now this thread has reached 30 pages.
I am sorry that you left out the remainder of his penultimate sentence in the above quote. Together with his 'Real child abuse', linking Arising, you and anyone else who disagrees with him as either 'brainwashed snowflakes' or 'spirit killers' - this is unacceptable in a PN forum.

This toxicity and continual personal abuse to others should not be allowed to continue.
However, at one point, AMod said he did not see anything wrong with his posts.
Looks like N is taking advantage of this, and the general tolerance here.
I expect more of the same...might well reach 90 pages or more....
And then another thread...

What has made you so afraid of ideas questioning the imagined dominance of a secular mindset? The idea of man living in imagination isn't new. Plato's Cave allegory is a most excellent description of the dynamics of imagination. I didn't invent the term metaphysical repression. Will you attack all good learned people who have used it and seriously contemplated the horror of what it actually is? Now you even attack Einstein for suggesting the human potential to become the cosmic man as opposed to remaining in imagination in Plato's cave. You want to be protected from basic philosophy. Why inflict your emotional rejections onto others?

Plato hit the nail on the head with this paragraph from the cave allegory

[Socrates] And if there were a contest, and he had to compete in measuring the shadows with the prisoners who had never moved out of the cave, while his sight was still weak, and before his eyes had become steady (and the time which would be needed to acquire this new habit of sight might be very considerable) would he not be ridiculous? Men would say of him that up he went and down he came without his eyes; and that it was better not even to think of ascending; and if any one tried to loose another and lead him up to the light, let them only catch the offender, and they would put him to death.

There is some sort of acquired imaginary fear that prevents the willing psychological ability to impartially witness. It seems right to indulge in fantasy or remain in fear and attack all conscious efforts towards psychological awakening so as to enable a cosmic perspective.
The dominance of imaginary fears. A natural result of the human condition