Is North Korea successful?

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Above us only sky
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Is North Korea successful?

Post by Above us only sky »

Recently a Russian friend of mine returned from North Korea after having a two-week holiday there. She told me North Korea is not what you think it is, actually it is quite successful in nation-building, here is her reasons:

1.North Korea is not Egypt or Iraq right before another revolution, the Democratic People's Republic of Korea is not a poor desperate third-world unstable middle east country, on the contrary, it is a highly-developed right-wing ultra-conservative egalitarian state with a super stable single-party system.
If you go to India, you will see tons of very poor people of lower class under the Indian caste system. If you visit downtown Shanghai, you will see lots of beggars sitting right before the front door of major super-malls every morning to beg for food and money. However, in North Korea, there are political prisoners but no beggars. People there are poorer than you, they have no access to the internet and no smart phones, BUT they are really not people living a life of absolute poverty: under the egalitarian planned economy, they enjoy a fair amount of food ration, free housing, free education, free health care, free holidays, even free condoms. Of course, every thing ( :shock: INCLUDING condoms :shock: ) is of low-quality, but thing is, they are free. Don't forget the unemployment rate in Spain is 27%, that figure is 0% in North Korea.

2.North Korea WILL NOT COLLAPSE in the face of sanction whatsoever.
Believe or not, the Soviet Union collapsed not because of American sanction and boycott, it collapsed due to two major reasons:
First, its own ideological crisis, when the Marxist-Leninist Utopia the Soviet Union claimed to be to its people turns out to be a dystopia, the Marxist-Leninist state will loose legitimacy and collapse whatsoever.
Second, too much involvement into the global free market. The Soviet Union remained the No. 1 oil export country in the 1980s, it maintains a certain level of standard of living for its people by selling oil into the global free market then use that oil money to pay their military bill and buy food and consumer products then distribute the goods via the domestic central planning system to its people. But when the global oil price collapses near the year 1989 the Soviet Union has no means to make ends meet let alone distributing enough consumer products, and people will protest and seek change when their living standards is falling.

North Korea is very different:
The ideology that sustains that state is not leftist Marxist-Leninism or Maoism, it is an ultra-conservative ideology, called the Juche Idea. the Juche Idea has a major advantage over Marxist ideology, it did not promise anything Utopian in the future therefore when that Utopia did not come nobody will experience any ideological crisis.
Also, unlike the soviet union, the economy of North Korea is a very self-sufficient one, it has no much oil to sell. If you visit North Korea, you will see that lots of cars there even don’t need gasoline, they burn coal to run. And in a 100% central planning economy, there is no such thing called Great Depression.
In the end, sanction will only make a highly self-sufficient economy more self-sufficient than ever.If you are in the daydreaming process of a North Korea collapse, think of Cuba.

Like North Korea or not, what can you do about it?
BTW, here is the sort of singer my friend met in a bar exclusive for turists in Pyongyang, Gee! If Paul McCartney had met that North Korean gal he will write a Back In The DPRK!!!!!!!! :shock: :shock: :shock:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o63mGktKJJU
Last edited by Above us only sky on Sat Sep 09, 2017 8:16 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Harbal
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Re: Is North Korea successful?

Post by Harbal »

Wow! It makes me wish I could go and live there. :?
Above us only sky
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Re: Is North Korea successful?

Post by Above us only sky »

Harbal wrote: Sat Sep 09, 2017 7:55 pm Wow! It makes me wish I could go and live there. :?
Honestly, If you went there you will be treated like a hero escaping from the evil west. Of course, as long as you remain loyal to the good old Kim :roll: :roll: :roll:
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Re: Is North Korea successful?

Post by Harbal »

Above us only sky wrote: Sat Sep 09, 2017 8:17 pm
Honestly, If you went there you will be treated like a hero escaping from the evil west. Of course, as long as you remain loyal to the good old Kim :roll: :roll: :roll:
Maybe I'll stay where I am just in case your Russian friend's account is not 100% trustworthy.
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Re: Is North Korea successful?

Post by Above us only sky »

Harbal wrote: Sat Sep 09, 2017 8:26 pm
Above us only sky wrote: Sat Sep 09, 2017 8:17 pm
Honestly, If you went there you will be treated like a hero escaping from the evil west. Of course, as long as you remain loyal to the good old Kim :roll: :roll: :roll:
Maybe I'll stay where I am just in case your Russian friend's account is not 100% trustworthy.
It all depends on your nationality, if you were American, a vegetable state might happen to you :shock:
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Harbal
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Re: Is North Korea successful?

Post by Harbal »

Above us only sky wrote: Sat Sep 09, 2017 8:54 pm
It all depends on your nationality, if you were American, a vegetable state might happen to you :shock:
I don't know what you mean by that, do you know what you mean? Anyway, I'm not American.
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Re: Is North Korea successful?

Post by vegetariantaxidermy »

No doubt true, except for your comments about Iraq and Egypt. Iraq was pretty much as you describe NK. Not 'third world' but it certainly is now.
But of course the yanks don't care about any of that. Their agenda is finding a new playground target. They've had their fun with the ME and I think they are a bit bored with their broken toy.
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Sir-Sister-of-Suck
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Re: Is North Korea successful?

Post by Sir-Sister-of-Suck »

Above us only sky wrote: Sat Sep 09, 2017 5:08 pmright-wing ultra-conservative egalitarian state with a super stable single-party system.
Uhhhhhh what. I mean, the constitution of North Korea describes itself as a Social-communism. I can see why you don't think it's a socialist state, although from what I understand it's a nation with social policies that are just very poor, but let's just be clear that authoritarianism doesn't have anything to do with left or right, it has to do with up and down.
Also, unlike the soviet union, the economy of North Korea is a very self-sufficient one, it has no much oil to sell. If you visit North Korea, you will see that lots of cars there even don’t need gasoline, they burn coal to run. And in a 100% central planning economy, there is no such thing called Great Depression.
Well, they have very mineral-rich mountains and a steady plutonium source, which is what they often trade and gives them the leverage with China.

Anyway, their current military capabilities don't concern me at all. As I've had to bring up a few times before, NK is operating on soviet union 1960-80 ICBM technology, except they have even less of a power grid. Even back then, America could successfully shoot down the soviet ICBMs.

My main concern lies on china backing them, or if a potential leadership in china ever does. We would be in very big trouble if that ever happens. Should the opportunity arise that we can take care of this problem state without invoking a war with china as well, it's an opportunity we should seriously consider taking.
Last edited by Sir-Sister-of-Suck on Sat Sep 09, 2017 9:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Is North Korea successful?

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vegetariantaxidermy wrote: Sat Sep 09, 2017 9:03 pm No doubt true, except for your comments about Iraq and Egypt. Iraq was pretty much as you describe NK. Not 'third world' but it certainly is now.
But of course the yanks don't care about any of that. Their agenda is finding a new playground target. They've had their fun with the ME and I think they are a bit bored with their broken toy.
False.

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Re: Is North Korea successful?

Post by vegetariantaxidermy »

Sir-Sister-of-Suck wrote: Sat Sep 09, 2017 9:14 pm
Above us only sky wrote: Sat Sep 09, 2017 5:08 pmright-wing ultra-conservative egalitarian state with a super stable single-party system.
Uhhhhhh what. I mean, the constitution of North Korea describes itself as a Social-communism. I can see why you don't think it's a socialist state, although from what I understand it's a nation with social policies that are just very poor, but let's just be clear that authoritarianism doesn't have anything to do with left or right, it has to do with up and down.
Also, unlike the soviet union, the economy of North Korea is a very self-sufficient one, it has no much oil to sell. If you visit North Korea, you will see that lots of cars there even don’t need gasoline, they burn coal to run. And in a 100% central planning economy, there is no such thing called Great Depression.
Well, they have very mineral-rich mountains and a steady plutonium source, which is what they often trade and gives them the leverage with China.

Anyway, their current military capabilities don't concern me at all. As I've had to bring up a few times before, NK is operating on soviet union 1960-80 ICBM technology, except they have even less of a power grid. Even back then, America could successfully shoot down the soviet ICBMs.

My main concern lies on china backing them, or if a potential leadership in china ever does. We would be in very big trouble if that ever happens. Should the opportunity arise that we can take care of this problem state without invoking a war with china as well, it's an opportunity we should seriously consider taking.
Have you always been a vile little warmonger? And what business is it of yours how NK is run? So it's rich in resources? That explains the US 'concern' for it then.
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Re: Is North Korea successful?

Post by vegetariantaxidermy »

Philosophy Explorer wrote: Sat Sep 09, 2017 9:15 pm
vegetariantaxidermy wrote: Sat Sep 09, 2017 9:03 pm No doubt true, except for your comments about Iraq and Egypt. Iraq was pretty much as you describe NK. Not 'third world' but it certainly is now.
But of course the yanks don't care about any of that. Their agenda is finding a new playground target. They've had their fun with the ME and I think they are a bit bored with their broken toy.
False.

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Sir-Sister-of-Suck
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Re: Is North Korea successful?

Post by Sir-Sister-of-Suck »

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: Sat Sep 09, 2017 9:26 pm Have you always been a vile little warmonger? And what business is it of yours how NK is run? So it's rich in resources? That explains the US 'concern' for it then.
Clearly I'm not. It's a very strict and nuanced contingency, and I absolutely do not want to see any preemptive attack made on North Korea should that contingency not be there. In fact, if we went ahead with a preemptive strike regardless of china's dismay, that would go against the very motive why I think an attack should even be considered, and an unbelievably stupid move.

Well, no. The US clearly has no plan on converting primarily to nuclear fission power anytime soon, and even if we did we can obtain the resources needed from Europe.
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Re: Is North Korea successful?

Post by Harbal »

Sir-Sister-of-Suck wrote: Sat Sep 09, 2017 10:02 pm that would go against the very motive why I think an attack should even be considered, and an unbelievably stupid move.
Fear not, for that to happen there would have to be an unbelievably stupid person giving the orders. :?
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Re: Is North Korea successful?

Post by Sir-Sister-of-Suck »

Harbal wrote: Sat Sep 09, 2017 10:07 pm
Sir-Sister-of-Suck wrote: Sat Sep 09, 2017 10:02 pm that would go against the very motive why I think an attack should even be considered, and an unbelievably stupid move.
Fear not, for that to happen there would have to be an unbelievably stupid person giving the orders. :?
It's not even trumps decision.
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Re: Is North Korea successful?

Post by Philosophy Explorer »

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: Sat Sep 09, 2017 9:27 pm
Philosophy Explorer wrote: Sat Sep 09, 2017 9:15 pm
vegetariantaxidermy wrote: Sat Sep 09, 2017 9:03 pm No doubt true, except for your comments about Iraq and Egypt. Iraq was pretty much as you describe NK. Not 'third world' but it certainly is now.
But of course the yanks don't care about any of that. Their agenda is finding a new playground target. They've had their fun with the ME and I think they are a bit bored with their broken toy.
False.

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Not stalking you. Just making corrections (btw you do stalk me). Why don't you add me to your foe list to make it impossible to stalk you?

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