is Humanity hopeless? (with Humans ignorance & stupidity)

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TSBU
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Re: Re:

Post by TSBU »

Hobbes' Choice wrote:
It's s stupid dichotomy as we have no idea what life was like back then, certainly not in terms of the issues Quirk is talking about.
True, 200000 years is a lot. Let's take a look at 2000 years ago, and start moving forwards... Even I admit that humans are usually better (I think that's because they are controlled better). But I don't know, if you had asked a slave not so long ago maybe they would have answered other thing. There is a great wall in China, built by slaves, and because of a war.

Yeah, now there is enough food for everybody and people die of hunger. Before, there wasn't enough food, there was the same "equality" (or less, I think it's not so common to have a king who can say "kill that guy, he looked at me"), and people died anyway. And they'll keep dying.

There is an evident benefit in saving a man's life, and the man is going to be (theoretically) grateful: If a man goes and put a building offering food for work 10 hours/day in a hard phisical work for children, many people would scream that it is slavery (even when the man is providing the food they need to live, is saving their lifes). Yep, that man is a bastard, he show the oportunity,he catched it, and he prefers to keep that people ignorant cause they are cheaperthat way... but people doesn't care, many people say that there aren't evil people here, and they buy the cheaper products.

Now, if a man goes there and offers education etc, tryng to give a good life and a good job for people there... many people would say the same, and, more important, in their life, they wouldn't pay but for destroy that man, just because he earns more than them and evidently the cost of that education and better products is going to be in the price.

People are stupid, that won't change. They are not necesarily "evil", but now, every big organization, like google (I know people who worked for them (not cleaning XD)) lives being what people wants them to be in the end, liers, cruel bastards who destroy competitors. The more people scream against it, the more they pay for it. They get dellusional, so what they do? they vote for Trump (don't forget that every "system" or "politics" are for me an equal lie, I'm just trying to show peole psichology, it would be the same with Hitler, it is the same with authoritarian comunists... the more people is bad, the more they "love the chains" (famous shout by the way in my own country)), the world is expensive, they are surrounded by people who are dishonest, what do they do? pay for the stolen stuff because it's cheaper and they want to compete too (Never put a barrier against people who are acting bad, not alone) etc. And scream that they are surrounded by selfish people... in their computer, with a coke in their hands, in their house, to feel that they are nice people, very worried about eating only vegetables... while people die of hunger.

It won't change. Not my problem.
Walker
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Re: Re:

Post by Walker »

Hobbes' Choice wrote:
TSBU wrote:
HexHammer wrote:..all is good.
Image
Oh look humanity at a time in history when there is more than enough food for everyone.
Those poor starving children appear to be under eight years of age, although malnutrition can change the appearance of age.

For the past eight years, Obama was POTUS. Blame Obama.

And if you don't blame him, blame the rulers of the country in which those children live.
Check their personal assets.
Also, check the assets of the rulers in bordering countries.
Question where these monies came from, and why they are not used to feed the starving children.

Some say Safe Zones in Syria will simply make for easier targets.
Some say once you step into a situation, you own it.
Some say that if you are at all involved in the chain of karma, you own it.
Being a humanitarian country, at great expense and logistical challenges the US has often coordinated things like Safe Zones, like the Marshall Plan, like financing the United Nations that is supposed to tend to starving people. Ostensibly.


“ Love every one, feed every one, remember god, tell the Truth.”
- Neem Karoli Baba
http://www.maharajji.com/Maharajji-Quot ... rajji.html
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Greta
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Re: Re:

Post by Greta »

Hobbes' Choice wrote:
Greta wrote:
henry quirk wrote:We're a rock-scrabble species, sure, but -- no -- we're not a lost cause.

Yeah, we're crass and mercenary, but we're also quite noble and inventive when we get ourselves up for it.

My evidence?

Compare what we are now to what what we were 200,000 years back.

Only the willfully blind can say man, today, is what he was back then.
Weird. I agree with you completely :shock:
It's s stupid dichotomy as we have no idea what life was like back then, certainly not in terms of the issues Quirk is talking about.
I don't much care about the numbers - 200k, 2,000, whatever. Bottom line is humanity has developed. Yes, humanity remains flawed but we don't live in caves or grass huts, don't die during childbirth nearly so often, nor nail people to pieces of wood nor burn them as witches. We have re-learned that other species are sentient. We don't believe the Sun revolves around the Earth and most are well are aware that there is no big man in the sky.

Yes, at present the west is going through a backwards thinking phase. Stuff happens. Development is not linear.
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Post by henry quirk »

Like I said: get bent, commie.
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henry quirk
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"the west is going through a backwards thinking phase"

Post by henry quirk »

How so?
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HexHammer
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Re:

Post by HexHammer »

TSBU wrote:
HexHammer wrote:..all is good.
Image
All is not perfect, but still good.
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Hobbes' Choice
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Re: Re:

Post by Hobbes' Choice »

Walker wrote:
For the past eight years, Obama was POTUS. Blame Obama.
You're mental.

I don't think you can lay the blame for every sick hungry child at the door of OB.
If you think there is some responsibility with the US government, you might want to look at the majority Republican party.
OB has been a lame duck for years, and a POTUS that respects democracy has limited power.

Thankfully Trump has no respect for democracy and has been happily abusing his power to write Executive Orders without reference to your elected representatives. Soon you will be able, with more justification to lay the blame at Trumps door with far more conviction.
Walker
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Re: Re:

Post by Walker »

Hobbes' Choice wrote:
Walker wrote:
For the past eight years, Obama was POTUS. Blame Obama.
You're mental.

I don't think you can lay the blame for every sick hungry child at the door of OB.
If you think there is some responsibility with the US government, you might want to look at the majority Republican party.
OB has been a lame duck for years, and a POTUS that respects democracy has limited power.

Thankfully Trump has no respect for democracy and has been happily abusing his power to write Executive Orders without reference to your elected representatives. Soon you will be able, with more justification to lay the blame at Trumps door with far more conviction.
If you review the record, you will notice that you were given other options to rationalize aiming blame.

As if you need any.

You don't have to blame Obama.

He was only the Almighty POTUS, the most powerful mortal on the planet Earth.

You would think that he could have fed some kids. What kind of monster was he to not feed those kids, after giving all that money to the UN. Did he ever question where that money went? Was he just a monster of incompetence and deflecting blame?

Now, Trump is the most powerful mortal.

Everyone is all shook up.
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Conde Lucanor
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Re: is Humanity hopeless? (with Humans ignorance & stupidity)

Post by Conde Lucanor »

niki wrote: And perhaps the saddest & biggest irony in Life/Reality is: the smart & wise people are often drowned in the sea of stupidity (only a very few lucky ones that can arise & impacted/changed the history of Mankind, Civilization & Humanity).
That shows that despite all those unfavorable circumstances, there has been human progress.
niki wrote:Do you think Humanity is hopeless?
Or, do you have some valid arguments in your *Hope* that Humanity still can be saved, and that there is still a bright/better future for Humanity, and/or that Humanity will survive somehow?
Socialism is the only chance.

Imagine there's no heaven
It's easy if you try
No hell below us
Above us only sky
Imagine all the people
Living for today... Aha-ah...

Imagine there's no countries
It isn't hard to do
Nothing to kill or die for
And no religion, too
Imagine all the people
Living life in peace... You...

You may say I'm a dreamer
But I'm not the only one
I hope someday you'll join us
And the world will be as one

Imagine no possessions
I wonder if you can
No need for greed or hunger
A brotherhood of man
Imagine all the people
Sharing all the world... You...

You may say I'm a dreamer
But I'm not the only one
I hope someday you'll join us
And the world will live as one
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TSBU
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Post by TSBU »

Ok, after reading the answerws, I change mine. it is hopeless.
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Hobbes' Choice
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Re: Re:

Post by Hobbes' Choice »

Walker wrote:
Everyone is all shook up.
I dare say you have not the wit to realise just what the fuck is going on with your POTUS.
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Hobbes' Choice
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Re: is Humanity hopeless? (with Humans ignorance & stupidity)

Post by Hobbes' Choice »

Conde Lucanor wrote:
niki wrote: And perhaps the saddest & biggest irony in Life/Reality is: the smart & wise people are often drowned in the sea of stupidity (only a very few lucky ones that can arise & impacted/changed the history of Mankind, Civilization & Humanity).
That shows that despite all those unfavorable circumstances, there has been human progress.
niki wrote:Do you think Humanity is hopeless?
Or, do you have some valid arguments in your *Hope* that Humanity still can be saved, and that there is still a bright/better future for Humanity, and/or that Humanity will survive somehow?
Socialism is the only chance.
True. Now as ever. Now needed more than ever.
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Greta
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Re:

Post by Greta »

TSBU wrote:Ok, after reading the answerws, I change mine. it is hopeless.
Ha! When considering "grading" humanity, I don't know if your country had a change in school reports in the 90s as we had here. The idea was not to discourage poorly performed children. So, instead of giving the child a mark and rank in the class, you would have grades like Outstanding, Good, Average and Developing.

I always liked the "Developing" grade - such a kind way of saying that your kid is a blundering goofball :) So, when considering humanity's "grade", you'd have to say "Developing" ... and hopefully that means more than just a euphemism, that we really will make progress. However, given the rise in irrationality, general AI seems much more likely to eventually become wise than humanity, and that's not guaranteed either.
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TSBU
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Re: Re:

Post by TSBU »

Greta wrote:
TSBU wrote:Ok, after reading the answerws, I change mine. it is hopeless.
Ha! When considering "grading" humanity, I don't know if your country had a change in school reports in the 90s as we had here. The idea was not to discourage poorly performed children. So, instead of giving the child a mark and rank in the class, you would have grades like Outstanding, Good, Average and Developing.

I always liked the "Developing" grade - such a kind way of saying that your kid is a blundering goofball :) So, when considering humanity's "grade", you'd have to say "Developing" ... and hopefully that means more than just a euphemism, that we really will make progress. However, given the rise in irrationality, general AI seems much more likely to eventually become wise than humanity, and that's not guaranteed either.

Yep. In "my country" "we" have one of the worst "educational systems" in "first world", in fact, it is a contry where there is a lot of functional Illiteracy, and we have what we call "ninis": ni estudio ni trabajo. There are a lot of ridiculous things, like the one you said ("necesita mejorar" is what they say in my country), or forbide the note 0, and worse... very worse. But I wasn't thinking in that, that alone won't destroy humanity. If I think carefully in some of the famous books dystopias, what we have now isn't very worse, but I'm sure that in every point of history, there were people who felt anoyed and isolated in a sea of stupidity who wanted to burn them.

But thinking in an "end" for humanity, I'm sure of this: Things will change "fast", and drastically, and what we understand as human life now, is going to be more strange in 100 years to the next generations (if they still have sense of strange) than the cavemen for us now. I don't like to see things as a whole, some people will be better, some worse, like always, but "my kind" would probably find it like hell. And that's due to comunication, it will techincally improve to a level (it is improving now) where being isolated will mean death, useless. Every human being can improve humans knowledge only a little, most of what we know is from other humans, but being more conected is a danger too... I think I started a thread about seeing everybody all the time some time ago, and I'm sure that it will happen. So, will those who don't fit the norm survive against the idiotic majority? will seeing more things make people enough aware of reality and accept truth, or will it be more info than they want to accept and mean destruction of what they find ugly? History is full of crap and a few good people (I don't like the word people XD it's a very common mistake to beginers in English to say "persons").

I don't know if humans will end like monkeys like in that bad film "idiocracy", if all will end in a nuclear wasteland, an enormous pandemia, overpopulation and contamination... I must recognice that eliminating all what is genetically human in a fast move is very difficult, a small percentage can regenerate the specie... it is related, of course, with the idiotic majority, with the current igonrance...but not too much... how to say it in English... In Spanish I would say "depende de lo que somos, no de cómo estamos", in my poor English the best translation I can imagine is "it doesn't matter how ignorant we are, not what we have inside us, but how intelligent we are, or what can or can't be inside us".

It's a very hard question in truth, impossible to answer something really serious. I want to believe that humans can live seeing each other, I can't live with the other possibility. And... I live with my life, I really don't think too much in the world. I'm from other planet and other specie anyway.
thedoc
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Re: is Humanity hopeless? (with Humans ignorance & stupidity)

Post by thedoc »

Conde Lucanor wrote: Imagine there's no heaven
It's easy if you try
No hell below us
Above us only sky
Imagine all the people
Living for today... Aha-ah...

Imagine there's no countries
It isn't hard to do
Nothing to kill or die for
And no religion, too
Imagine all the people
Living life in peace... You...

You may say I'm a dreamer
But I'm not the only one
I hope someday you'll join us
And the world will be as one

Imagine no possessions
I wonder if you can
No need for greed or hunger
A brotherhood of man
Imagine all the people
Sharing all the world... You...

You may say I'm a dreamer
But I'm not the only one
I hope someday you'll join us
And the world will live as one
The atheists theme song, at least religious people try to do something, all the atheists do is sit around saying OHM, and singing kumbaya. As if that is going to help all those who need real help.

Atheists don't even know what it means, they just think it sounds nice. kumbaya means "Come by me Lord", It's a call to God.
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