Terrapin Station wrote:
Wait, some people felt that all apologies were the same in terms of the motivations, sincerity, etc. of the person presenting the apology???
NielsBohr wrote:Huh? Who are "some people" for you, and where did you read the remaining ?
I had just quoted Greta saying "Some felt that apologies were insincere and futile . . . "
Well, in fact am I near to think the same, (even if I do not know where you read that).
Ah! I think to understand: The consideration about wondering about sincerity were not from the one who beg pardon - since he is doing it - but from the one who has to deliver such a pardon...
That seems obvious, but in fact, it is not... for the same reason: The one who beg for pardon does not take his request under questioning, so it does not represent the "standard feeling" nor the "referential" - it is only the one who may deliver the pardon who were making such questioning... precisely in the purpose to give - or not - pardon.
Terrapin Station wrote:
NielsBohr wrote:Indeed, this seems to be obvious.
Why would you think that everyone has the same thing in mind, the same disposition, etc. when they apologize? Clearly different situations, different people are different.
Hum... This seems pertinent. But in a thought experiment, we almost cannot consider such different people. Having already the two situations of the one who beg for pardon, and the one for the other who deliver the pardon, if you add different parameters as "disposition", you get two differences (two parameters), so that a variation cannot anymore be attributed to one rather than the other parameter.
So even if your argument is realistic, it is a bad idea; philosophy is about simplification (idealization), as an abstraction is not for pleasure, but at the contrary because the reality in such is too complex.
But I even wonder about "same disposition" in an abstract experiment. I am not sure it is the point. Being what it is, same "disposition" does not mean at all "same behaviour" nor "same action" for different situations... except if the second situation is the second in time without any other difference, in which case it were the perfect mirror of the first, letting expecting the same result...
But even in this case, the consideration is not worthless, because even if we know that they will act the same in the future, that does not tell us anything about the first action. That written, if the "dispositions" were absolutely the same (in fact, let's say: the same mind), then we should wait for the pardon effective release since the first requested it.
So... not sure about disposition being the same or not. Maybe you went to deep in the question. In my case, by example, I only gave example from my reality. Maybe, instead of taking the problem foundation under questioning (as everything is questionnable), just answer as you feel, and if you don't care of this topic, take another. Let yourself acts as you wish, and - for God - live!!!