What is the English way?

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vegetariantaxidermy
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Re: What is the English way?

Post by vegetariantaxidermy »

Arising_uk wrote:
vegetariantaxidermy wrote:Applied to what? Where did I mention Appiah? I was probably referring to Hobbes.
"Next the 'progressives' will be insisting there's 'no such thing' as species." You were talking about your wiki of Appiah so presumably you meant him as this 'progressive'. If so I wonder why you brought up "species" as you appear to be using it to affirm the idea of 'race'?
I wasn't referring to Appiah, which is probably why I didn't mention him.
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Arising_uk
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Re: What is the English way?

Post by Arising_uk »

vegetariantaxidermy wrote:I wasn't referring to Appiah, which is probably why I didn't mention him.
So who were you referring to when you said you wikked them and then that these 'progressives' would, etc? And what were you referring to?
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Re: What is the English way?

Post by vegetariantaxidermy »

Arising_uk wrote:
vegetariantaxidermy wrote:Applied to what? Where did I mention Appiah? I was probably referring to Hobbes.
"Next the 'progressives' will be insisting there's 'no such thing' as species." You were talking about your wiki of Appiah so presumably you meant him as this 'progressive'. If so I wonder why you brought up "species" as you appear to be using it to affirm the idea of 'race'?
I deliberately made a new paragraph. My ONLY comment about Appiah was that I wiki'd him and that he didn't do it for me. It's quite funny the way so-called 'progressives' either roll out the 'R' word, or resort to petty nit-picking to silence anyone who doesn't agree with them. 'Races don't exist' doesn't even mean anything, unless you define exactly what you mean by 'race' in the first place. Medical researchers can't avoid differentiating between groups of people, because some groups are more susceptible to certain diseases than others. So now, 'ethnicity' = ok, 'race' = not ok.
It reminds me of a line in a wonderful Canadian series called Murdoch Mysteries. It's set around 1910. Detective Murdoch was describing a mentally handicapped person as an 'imbecile'. His constable corrected him and said, 'Imbecile is not considered a polite term these days sir. I believe the correct term to use nowadays is 'moron' '.
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Hobbes' Choice
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Re: What is the English way?

Post by Hobbes' Choice »

vegetariantaxidermy wrote:
Hobbes' Choice wrote:
vegetariantaxidermy wrote: I said it wouldn't be PC now. I don't know what you are on about, and it's not worth an argument.
I'm puzzled, then, why you are contributing to a thread called "What is the English way"? I suggest that this primitve sort of tribalism is not only mythical, but divisive and harmful to humanity's future.
Monty Python is best characterised as "British" or "English" in that with each sketch it made fun of and ridiculed the very things that are considered to be the "British way of life", but take away the bowler hat, and the handlebar moustache of the Brigadier, and you have a sketch that could just as well have been a critique of any upper/middle class society on western europe.
So you think there is no such thing as cultural identity. What an odd, homogenous bubble you live in. In your world no one would ever be able to say, 'The English have a good sense of humour', or 'Americans are very literal', or 'Chinese are hard workers', or 'Germans are arrogant' etc. etc. Of course these things aren't true of ALL of them, but when they are true for ENOUGH of them for it to be noticed by A LOT of people then it's just stupid to say it's simply an illusion. And I'm pretty sure you've been 'guilty' of doing it. Anyone who says they never have is lying.
No I'm suggesting that we are primarily heterogenous, and that the imposition of "British" is labelling. If you accept the label then it is you that is pushing the argument towards homogeneity, not me.
If you accept "British" then you cannot blame others with tarring you with a brush that contains a particular set of attitudes, beliefs and cultural norms. Well good luck with that, But there is not a single belief, attitude, or norm that is exclusively British. And your only attempt to suggest something uniquely British (Monty Python) has already been withdrawn by you on the grounds that it is too sexist.
At the time of production Monty Python split the population in two, and many considered it to be anything BUT British, especially as it seemed to set out to undermine cherished British views. So where is "British" exactly?
I'm still waiting for you to tell me what being "English" is?
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Hobbes' Choice
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Re: What is the English way?

Post by Hobbes' Choice »

vegetariantaxidermy wrote:
Arising_uk wrote:
vegetariantaxidermy wrote:Applied to what? Where did I mention Appiah? I was probably referring to Hobbes.
"Next the 'progressives' will be insisting there's 'no such thing' as species." You were talking about your wiki of Appiah so presumably you meant him as this 'progressive'. If so I wonder why you brought up "species" as you appear to be using it to affirm the idea of 'race'?
I deliberately made a new paragraph. My ONLY comment about Appiah was that I wiki'd him and that he didn't do it for me..
\
Try and extend your attention span and listen to what he had to say.
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Hobbes' Choice
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Re: What is the English way?

Post by Hobbes' Choice »

Arising_uk wrote:
vegetariantaxidermy wrote:Applied to what? Where did I mention Appiah? I was probably referring to Hobbes.
"Next the 'progressives' will be insisting there's 'no such thing' as species." You were talking about your wiki of Appiah so presumably you meant him as this 'progressive'. If so I wonder why you brought up "species" as you appear to be using it to affirm the idea of 'race'?
Species is a clearly definable natural category. Suggesting that "progressives" (a term about as useless as "English") are going to suggest there is no such thing is what we call in the business; a slippery slope fallacy.

I wonder if Vegetarian Tax has a whole bucket of pigeon-holing terms ready to slag off the next reasonable person she meets?
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Re: What is the English way?

Post by vegetariantaxidermy »

Hobbes' Choice wrote:
Arising_uk wrote:
vegetariantaxidermy wrote:Applied to what? Where did I mention Appiah? I was probably referring to Hobbes.
"Next the 'progressives' will be insisting there's 'no such thing' as species." You were talking about your wiki of Appiah so presumably you meant him as this 'progressive'. If so I wonder why you brought up "species" as you appear to be using it to affirm the idea of 'race'?
Species is a clearly definable natural category. Suggesting that "progressives" (a term about as useless as "English") are going to suggest there is no such thing is what we call in the business; a slippery slope fallacy.

I wonder if Vegetarian Tax has a whole bucket of pigeon-holing terms ready to slag off the next reasonable person she meets?
Who did I 'slag off'? You don't expect me to agree with everything you say do you?
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Hobbes' Choice
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Re: What is the English way?

Post by Hobbes' Choice »

vegetariantaxidermy wrote:
Hobbes' Choice wrote:
Arising_uk wrote: "Next the 'progressives' will be insisting there's 'no such thing' as species." You were talking about your wiki of Appiah so presumably you meant him as this 'progressive'. If so I wonder why you brought up "species" as you appear to be using it to affirm the idea of 'race'?
Species is a clearly definable natural category. Suggesting that "progressives" (a term about as useless as "English") are going to suggest there is no such thing is what we call in the business; a slippery slope fallacy.

I wonder if Vegetarian Tax has a whole bucket of pigeon-holing terms ready to slag off the next reasonable person she meets?
Who did I 'slag off'? You don't expect me to agree with everything you say do you?

I supposed you are now going to give us a definition of "progressive"? You've done a quick Google and decided that Appiah is no good, so picked a convenient label to denigrate him.
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Re: What is the English way?

Post by Harbal »

Hobbes' Choice wrote:But there is not a single belief, attitude, or norm that is exclusively British.
There is not a single ingredient that is exclusive to marmalade but if you take a particular set of ingredients and mix them in a particular way in particular quantities you end up with marmalade. It's a similar principle with national identity. I don't know how much simpler I can make it for you, Hobbes.
Try and extend your attention span and listen to what he had to say.
The thing is: the more attention you pay to what he is saying, the more ridiculous he sounds.
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Re: What is the English way?

Post by vegetariantaxidermy »

Hobbes' Choice wrote:
I supposed you are now going to give us a definition of "progressive"? You've done a quick Google and decided that Appiah is no good, so picked a convenient label to denigrate him.
Do you think I haven't heard the 'no race' argument before? To say there is no such thing without even defining it in the first place is just political grandstanding.
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Re: What is the English way?

Post by Hobbes' Choice »

vegetariantaxidermy wrote:
Hobbes' Choice wrote:
I supposed you are now going to give us a definition of "progressive"? You've done a quick Google and decided that Appiah is no good, so picked a convenient label to denigrate him.
Do you think I haven't heard the 'no race' argument before? To say there is no such thing without even defining it in the first place is just political grandstanding.
There is no suitable definition, that is exactly why it is bullshit.
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Re: What is the English way?

Post by vegetariantaxidermy »

Hobbes' Choice wrote:
vegetariantaxidermy wrote:
Hobbes' Choice wrote:
I supposed you are now going to give us a definition of "progressive"? You've done a quick Google and decided that Appiah is no good, so picked a convenient label to denigrate him.
Do you think I haven't heard the 'no race' argument before? To say there is no such thing without even defining it in the first place is just political grandstanding.
There is no suitable definition, that is exactly why it is bullshit.
If there has never been a definition then calling it non-existent is a bit superfluous isn't it? And btw, I never answer the 'race' or 'ethnicity' question on forms. It just goes against the grain. In fact I've always considered the question to be racist and offensive. That doesn't mean I have no identity other than 'human'.
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Re: What is the English way?

Post by Hobbes' Choice »

vegetariantaxidermy wrote:
Hobbes' Choice wrote:
vegetariantaxidermy wrote: Do you think I haven't heard the 'no race' argument before? To say there is no such thing without even defining it in the first place is just political grandstanding.
There is no suitable definition, that is exactly why it is bullshit.
If there has never been a definition then calling it non-existent is a bit superfluous isn't it? And btw, I never answer the 'race' or 'ethnicity' question on forms. It just goes against the grain. In fact I've always considered the question to be racist and offensive. That doesn't mean I have no identity other than 'human'.
Me too. I even scanned and doctored a form, that did not have "Other" to include one in to which I put, as I always do "Homo Sapiens".

As for other identities, my name pretty much covers all the bases.

You've still not answered what is the "English Way"
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Re: What is the English way?

Post by vegetariantaxidermy »

Hobbes' Choice wrote: Me too. I even scanned and doctored a form, that did not have "Other" to include one in to which I put, as I always do "Homo Sapiens".

As for other identities, my name pretty much covers all the bases.

You've still not answered what is the "English Way"
You should go back over my posts. And that's not a quote from me. Maybe you don't have any kind of cultural or national identity but that doesn't mean everyone feels that way. A country does acquire an identity regardless of what the PC claim to be the case with their disingenuous do-goodery and thought-policing.
You may get your wish soon. With globalisation there will eventually only be one cultural identity, and we all know what that will be (if they don't blow us up first).
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Re: What is the English way?

Post by duszek »

Everything can be found everywhere but to what degree ?

There are rapists both in India and in England, yes.
But what are the statistics ? What happens to the criminals ? What is the reaction of the society ?

If you happened to be a young penniless female orphan would you prefer to walk around and beg in India or in England ?
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