Socratic Ignorance vs Secular Intelligence

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Dubious
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Re: Socratic Ignorance vs Secular Intelligence

Post by Dubious » Fri Dec 22, 2017 11:17 am

"A wise man, recognizing that the world is but an illusion, does not act as if it is real, so he escapes the suffering". ~ Buddha

Well, that was easy! But I wonder how useful that sentiment is when your starving to death, slowly consumed by a plague, burned alive or in the process of being drawn and quartered. I have a feeling the Buddha wouldn't have been quite as nonchalant about the illusion had he experienced any of this.

If this is supposed to be wisdom it's as unfathomable as Donald Trump dedicating a few hours as President serving the poor at the local Salvation Army. Most oriental wisdom, not all, amounts to nothing more than a mountain load of crap.

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Re: Socratic Ignorance vs Secular Intelligence

Post by -1- » Fri Jan 19, 2018 1:05 am

Dubious wrote:
Fri Dec 22, 2017 11:17 am
"A wise man, recognizing that the world is but an illusion, does not act as if it is real, so he escapes the suffering". ~ Buddha

Well, that was easy! But I wonder how useful that sentiment is when your starving to death, slowly consumed by a plague, burned alive or in the process of being drawn and quartered. I have a feeling the Buddha wouldn't have been quite as nonchalant about the illusion had he experienced any of this.

If this is supposed to be wisdom it's as unfathomable as Donald Trump dedicating a few hours as President serving the poor at the local Salvation Army. Most oriental wisdom, not all, amounts to nothing more than a mountain load of crap.
Well, dubiouis, if you were quartered or whipped or something, and suffered, maybe you just act as if it were real, and therefore you suffer.

It is important to see which way is the donkey and which way is the cart.

I, personally, am very much an illused person. I take every instance of suffering for real.

But that does not mean that I'm right. It just means that I can't recognize that the world is an illusion.

It's like the wisdom in the "Hitchhikers' Guide to the Galaxy": you can fly like a bird, and not hit ground like a sack full of stones, if you can just forget hitting the ground and forget the fear of hitting the ground on your way down from somewhere. It is an important discovery, and I think some of us should be nominated to carry out the experiment.

Dubious
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Joined: Tue May 19, 2015 7:40 am

Re: Socratic Ignorance vs Secular Intelligence

Post by Dubious » Fri Jan 19, 2018 6:46 am

-1- wrote:
Fri Jan 19, 2018 1:05 am
Dubious wrote:
Fri Dec 22, 2017 11:17 am
"A wise man, recognizing that the world is but an illusion, does not act as if it is real, so he escapes the suffering". ~ Buddha

Well, that was easy! But I wonder how useful that sentiment is when your starving to death, slowly consumed by a plague, burned alive or in the process of being drawn and quartered. I have a feeling the Buddha wouldn't have been quite as nonchalant about the illusion had he experienced any of this.

If this is supposed to be wisdom it's as unfathomable as Donald Trump dedicating a few hours as President serving the poor at the local Salvation Army. Most oriental wisdom, not all, amounts to nothing more than a mountain load of crap.
Well, dubiouis, if you were quartered or whipped or something, and suffered, maybe you just act as if it were real, and therefore you suffer.

It is important to see which way is the donkey and which way is the cart.

I, personally, am very much an illused person. I take every instance of suffering for real.

But that does not mean that I'm right. It just means that I can't recognize that the world is an illusion.

It's like the wisdom in the "Hitchhikers' Guide to the Galaxy": you can fly like a bird, and not hit ground like a sack full of stones, if you can just forget hitting the ground and forget the fear of hitting the ground on your way down from somewhere. It is an important discovery, and I think some of us should be nominated to carry out the experiment.
The quote: "A wise man, recognizing that the world is but an illusion, does not act as if it is real, so he escapes the suffering". ~ Buddha was given by Nick who, as we all know, loves to quote.

It seems you misunderstood my intent. I don't believe in the world as illusion either and never did. Even if it is, how would I or anyone know the difference and what difference would that make to real suffering? The experience remains whether assumed real or not! That's one reason why I consider most of "Eastern Wisdom" as pure unpolluted malarkey. Many "impressionable" westerners regard Eastern wisdom as so much superior when it's nothing of the kind. The Buddha talking himself into believing that the world is an illusion is in no way an anodyne against pain mental or physical and that's the reason I wrote what I wrote.

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Re: Socratic Ignorance vs Secular Intelligence

Post by -1- » Fri Jan 19, 2018 10:25 am

Dubious wrote:
Fri Jan 19, 2018 6:46 am
-1- wrote:
Fri Jan 19, 2018 1:05 am
Dubious wrote:
Fri Dec 22, 2017 11:17 am
"A wise man, recognizing that the world is but an illusion, does not act as if it is real, so he escapes the suffering". ~ Buddha

Well, that was easy! But I wonder how useful that sentiment is when your starving to death, slowly consumed by a plague, burned alive or in the process of being drawn and quartered. I have a feeling the Buddha wouldn't have been quite as nonchalant about the illusion had he experienced any of this.

If this is supposed to be wisdom it's as unfathomable as Donald Trump dedicating a few hours as President serving the poor at the local Salvation Army. Most oriental wisdom, not all, amounts to nothing more than a mountain load of crap.
Well, dubiouis, if you were quartered or whipped or something, and suffered, maybe you just act as if it were real, and therefore you suffer.

It is important to see which way is the donkey and which way is the cart.

I, personally, am very much an illused person. I take every instance of suffering for real.

But that does not mean that I'm right. It just means that I can't recognize that the world is an illusion.

It's like the wisdom in the "Hitchhikers' Guide to the Galaxy": you can fly like a bird, and not hit ground like a sack full of stones, if you can just forget hitting the ground and forget the fear of hitting the ground on your way down from somewhere. It is an important discovery, and I think some of us should be nominated to carry out the experiment.
The quote: "A wise man, recognizing that the world is but an illusion, does not act as if it is real, so he escapes the suffering". ~ Buddha was given by Nick who, as we all know, loves to quote.

It seems you misunderstood my intent. I don't believe in the world as illusion either and never did. Even if it is, how would I or anyone know the difference and what difference would that make to real suffering? The experience remains whether assumed real or not! That's one reason why I consider most of "Eastern Wisdom" as pure unpolluted malarkey. Many "impressionable" westerners regard Eastern wisdom as so much superior when it's nothing of the kind. The Buddha talking himself into believing that the world is an illusion is in no way an anodyne against pain mental or physical and that's the reason I wrote what I wrote.
Erm... my reply was a joke. A sarcasm pointed at Nick_A, his quotes and his beliefs.

Sorry to have caused a confusion.

Yes, I understand that my sense of humour often needs a hands-on translator.

osgart
Posts: 443
Joined: Mon Oct 10, 2016 7:38 am

Re: Socratic Ignorance vs Secular Intelligence

Post by osgart » Tue Jan 23, 2018 3:26 am

To debate is to refute that which is not justifiable. It's useful for more black and white arguments.

A dialectic must compel, and is far more worthy an endeavour. When someone is literally trying to understand another, more fruitful things happen.

Debate breeds conflict, and a false sense of superiority. It's more show than go.

I really don't think anyone yet has a monopoly on logic. Nothing is logical til it becomes evident, by being highly functional.

I'm sure reality has plenty of qualities that are not logical. I say logic is a construct of the human mind, invented for survival. Logic only works with that which is knowable, and of use. There is plenty of reality outside of what is knowable. I vote Socratic ignorance.

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