~ EVOLVING INTO PURE CONSCIOUSNESS ~

So what's really going on?

Moderators: AMod, iMod

Ginkgo
Posts: 2657
Joined: Mon Apr 30, 2012 2:47 pm

Re: ~ EVOLVING INTO PURE CONSCIOUSNESS ~

Post by Ginkgo »

Bill Wiltrack wrote:.

Machine do now what we considered to be able to accomplish only by humans.


You can have a conversation with a voice activated robot. Self-driving cars have thousands of perception prompts with the outside environment per second. All major stock trades on the big boards are done through automated buy & sell contracts. Done faster and with more time sensitive precision than a human could.

Word programs correct your spelling and suggest sentence structure.

There are thousands of examples of revolutionary models that have become a part of what is known as the Third Industrial Revolution.
All of this has nothing to do with consciousness, they are all examples of machines mimicking some aspects of human intelligence. They are not examples of machine conscious. As I said before, there is no one in the field of artificial intelligence, or anywhere else for that matter that would claim a machine is conscious.
Bill Wiltrack wrote: You may not be able to understand it, but it's here,
You can drop that condescending attitude. I do understand it.






.
User avatar
Bill Wiltrack
Posts: 5468
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:52 pm
Location: Cleveland, Ohio, USA
Contact:

Re: ~ EVOLVING INTO PURE CONSCIOUSNESS ~

Post by Bill Wiltrack »

.







A machine's micro computer processors are very much like the human brain synopses reaction to outside stimulus.


Our intellectual function is based upon plus/negative, yes/no, on/off. Just as a computer model.


The thrust of my thread here is that more & more human beings such as myself are becoming more & more aware that we are machines.

Our body, our minds, our emotions are extremely mechanical and dependent upon outside circumstances.


As I have stated many times before human beings have the ability to experience many degrees of self-consciousness and perhaps, for even some, objective consciousness...sometimes known as higher consciousness.




I appreciate you attempting to begin to understand this rather difficult philosophical concept...Give it time.







.
User avatar
Terrapin Station
Posts: 4548
Joined: Wed Aug 03, 2016 7:18 pm
Location: NYC Man

Re: ~ EVOLVING INTO PURE CONSCIOUSNESS ~

Post by Terrapin Station »

What does anything in your last two posts have to do with saying what the heck "pure" versus "impure" conscious would be, Bill?

What the heck are "levels" of consciousness?

And the idea of "objective consciousness" is an oxymoron. What that phrase implies is that you don't understand the terms. How about trying to put your ideas into more precise terms that don't just read like nonsense? That would be a step towards you actually doing some philosophy.
User avatar
Bill Wiltrack
Posts: 5468
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:52 pm
Location: Cleveland, Ohio, USA
Contact:

Re: ~ EVOLVING INTO PURE CONSCIOUSNESS ~

Post by Bill Wiltrack »

.





Um, yeah...so...there's that.



I know all of you look-up to me & I'm cool with that. One of you actually calls me guru.


But, I must respectfully request that you do AT LEAST A MODICUM of self investigating. I mean, Google is here for EVERYONE to use.

I realize that many of you are from different countries and I have a world-wide following and SOME OF you may have never attended a college-type atmosphere where you do self study...

But really, you will benefit from doing at least SOME investigating yourself and then you won't look so asinine when you are here on the boards or talking to me.


But as I will always say, you can ask me anything in good faith and I will always respond.


There really is no dumb question...


Good luck with your independent search.








.
User avatar
Terrapin Station
Posts: 4548
Joined: Wed Aug 03, 2016 7:18 pm
Location: NYC Man

Re: ~ EVOLVING INTO PURE CONSCIOUSNESS ~

Post by Terrapin Station »

So basically, you don't know what the heck "pure" versus "impure" consciousness would be, or how to define "levels" of consciousness or anything like that.

Here are the conclusions from my years of research into these issues: the idea of pure/impure consciousness, levels of consciousness, etc. are pure nonsense.

What you'd benefit from, rather than reading pure crap like Gurdjieff, would be to read a philosophy of mind text (something lke this would be a good start: https://www.amazon.com/Blackwell-Guide- ... 0631217754), and a neuroscience textbook.
Last edited by Terrapin Station on Wed Sep 07, 2016 3:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
Bill Wiltrack
Posts: 5468
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:52 pm
Location: Cleveland, Ohio, USA
Contact:

Re: ~ EVOLVING INTO PURE CONSCIOUSNESS ~

Post by Bill Wiltrack »

.




Stick with that. Fits you pretty well...




.
Walker
Posts: 14280
Joined: Thu Nov 05, 2015 12:00 am

Re: ~ EVOLVING INTO PURE CONSCIOUSNESS ~

Post by Walker »

Bill Wiltrack wrote:.





Um, yeah...so...there's that.



I know all of you look-up to me & I'm cool with that. One of you actually calls me guru.


But, I must respectfully request that you do AT LEAST A MODICUM of self investigating. I mean, Google is here for EVERYONE to use.

I realize that many of you are from different countries and I have a world-wide following and SOME OF you may have never attended a college-type atmosphere where you do self study...

But really, you will benefit from doing at least SOME investigating yourself and then you won't look so asinine when you are here on the boards or talking to me.


But as I will always say, you can ask me anything in good faith and I will always respond.


There really is no dumb question...


Good luck with your independent search.








.
Bill, would you agree that pure, uncorrupted consciousness, which is experienced by man as a state of consciousness that allows no space for attachment to delusion, is the natural state of duality experienced by everyone; however consciousness corruption looms so large to attention as to over-shadow and distract from ever-existenct pure consciousness. Therefore, we can say that consciousness, functioning as the interface between you (awareness) and phenomena caused by universal motion towards balance, clarifies reality through loss of corruption rather than addition of purity. For example, PTSD is a corruption added on and can thus be subtracted out, but not through addition of purity. Purity isn’t added. It is revealed through subtraction, which is a natural, universal balancing movement towards renunciation. Question?
User avatar
Terrapin Station
Posts: 4548
Joined: Wed Aug 03, 2016 7:18 pm
Location: NYC Man

Re: ~ EVOLVING INTO PURE CONSCIOUSNESS ~

Post by Terrapin Station »

Walker wrote:Bill, would you agree that pure, uncorrupted consciousness, which is experienced by man as a state of consciousness that allows no space for attachment to delusion
Is there a difference between "(that allows) no space for attachment to delusion" and "just plain old "(that has) no attachment to delusion"?

Aside from that, how would you say one knows if one has an attachment to delusion?

"No attachment to delusion" doesn't just amount to "Believes is true the stuff that I believe is true" does it?
Walker
Posts: 14280
Joined: Thu Nov 05, 2015 12:00 am

Re: ~ EVOLVING INTO PURE CONSCIOUSNESS ~

Post by Walker »

Terrapin Station wrote:
Walker wrote:Bill, would you agree that pure, uncorrupted consciousness, which is experienced by man as a state of consciousness that allows no space for attachment to delusion
Is there a difference between "(that allows) no space for attachment to delusion" and "just plain old "(that has) no attachment to delusion"?

Aside from that, how would you say one knows if one has an attachment to delusion?

"No attachment to delusion" doesn't just amount to "Believes is true the stuff that I believe is true" does it?
You have asked three questions before our thread-host Bill could bestow honor upon my humble contribution by asking one. You must have a very busy mind tempered by impatience.

If it should be other than questions, your philosophy obviously requires belief, and so you seek comprehension in what you imagine must exist as a fog upon consciousness for all, since you project through questions that like you, everyone else must be limited by belief. Grasshopper, does non-delusional comprehension require belief, or simply uncorrupted observation?
User avatar
Terrapin Station
Posts: 4548
Joined: Wed Aug 03, 2016 7:18 pm
Location: NYC Man

Re: ~ EVOLVING INTO PURE CONSCIOUSNESS ~

Post by Terrapin Station »

Walker wrote:You have asked three questions before our thread-host Bill could bestow honor upon my humble contribution by asking one. You must have a very busy mind tempered by impatience.
Some violation of your personal posting etiquette or something?
If it should be other than questions, your philosophy obviously requires belief,
"Terrapin Station is a belief-averse atheist." <----WRONG.
and so you seek comprehension in what you imagine must exist as a fog upon consciousness for all,
"Terrapin Station thinks that consciousness is some sort of 'fog' (for all)." <----WRONG.
since you project through questions that like you, everyone else must be limited by belief.
"People can get 'beyond' belief (and still be alive and mentally active)." <---WRONG.
Grasshopper, does non-delusional comprehension require belief, or simply uncorrupted observation?
Delusion is an idea you invoked, not me. That would like me bringing up what I call my ontological perspectivalism or "reference-point relativism," you asking me a clarifying question, and then I ask you a conceptual question about it instead in return.

What about if we tried to have a good-faith, back-and-forth conversation instead of a bunch of attitude?
User avatar
Bill Wiltrack
Posts: 5468
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:52 pm
Location: Cleveland, Ohio, USA
Contact:

Re: ~ EVOLVING INTO PURE CONSCIOUSNESS ~

Post by Bill Wiltrack »

.




Bill, would you agree that pure, uncorrupted consciousness, which is experienced by man as a state of consciousness that allows no space for attachment to delusion, is the natural state of duality experienced by everyone; however consciousness corruption looms so large to attention as to over-shadow and distract from ever-existenct pure consciousness. Therefore, we can say that consciousness, functioning as the interface between you (awareness) and phenomena caused by universal motion towards balance, clarifies reality through loss of corruption rather than addition of purity. For example, PTSD is a corruption added on and can thus be subtracted out, but not through addition of purity. Purity isn’t added. It is revealed through subtraction, which is a natural, universal balancing movement towards renunciation. Question?



I would not make a statement like the one above but I support your articulation in doing so.


There is no right or wrong in the sphere of articulation of consciousness.


Consciousness, our state of being is constantly changing...and is, ultimately, something we need to experience ourselves.


I made a statement, I think in another thread, where philosophy; REAL philosophy is a jumping off into a wordless abandon. The description of ones observations in that trip is just that. A description.










.
User avatar
Bill Wiltrack
Posts: 5468
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:52 pm
Location: Cleveland, Ohio, USA
Contact:

Re: ~ EVOLVING INTO PURE CONSCIOUSNESS ~

Post by Bill Wiltrack »

.




...and...I would have hit the space bar a few times within the riff you spit above.


Jezus effen christ - This is the internet gurl!





.
User avatar
Arising_uk
Posts: 12314
Joined: Wed Oct 17, 2007 2:31 am

Re: ~ EVOLVING INTO PURE CONSCIOUSNESS ~

Post by Arising_uk »

Bill Wiltrack wrote:.Um, yeah...so...there's that.
LMFAO!

Good read and the irony that you slag-off NLP is breaking my ribs as NLP is just about the clearest set of simple and comprehensible techniques taken from psychology to pretty much achieve what the article posits, funnily enough the other one that came close was L.Ron's Dianetics before it became the nightmare that is TCoS. The thing is Bill is that you are so up your arse to become a guru that you will always be a gnu as you are trapped in the past and can't see the present. You should have read some Anglo-American Analytic Philosophy to improve your intellectual reasoning rather than stuck with the dead-end of 'hippy' Eastern Mysticism allied with the fairly barking mad Eastern European 'esoteric' gnus.
I know all of you look-up to me & I'm cool with that. One of you actually calls me guru.
:lol: You really need those glasses gnu.
But, I must respectfully request that you do AT LEAST A MODICUM of self investigating. I mean, Google is here for EVERYONE to use.
Oh! Now words are your friends are they? :lol:
I realize that many of you are from different countries and I have a world-wide following and SOME OF you may have never attended a college-type atmosphere where you do self study...
:lol: You mean this 'world-wide' following of being banned from every site and forum you visit?
But really, you will benefit from doing at least SOME investigating yourself and then you won't look so asinine when you are here on the boards or talking to me.
:lol: Modesty and arrogance part of your 'enlightened objective consciousness' is it?

What on earth makes you thinks others haven't been there and done that?
But as I will always say, you can ask me anything in good faith and I will always respond.
:lol: :lol: :lol: But not with anything to do with the question.
There really is no dumb question...
True but there is an inability to answer them which you have in spades.
Good luck with your independent search.[/size].
KMA comes to mind.
Last edited by Arising_uk on Wed Sep 07, 2016 11:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Walker
Posts: 14280
Joined: Thu Nov 05, 2015 12:00 am

Re: ~ EVOLVING INTO PURE CONSCIOUSNESS ~

Post by Walker »

Bill Wiltrack wrote:.




...and...I would have hit the space bar a few times within the riff you spit above.


Jezus effen christ - This is the internet gurl!





.
But of course (smack forehead). It was staring me in the face. A block of text is itself distracting. It needs trimming. Distilled. More of what matters, less of what doesn’t. Persevering to follow your insightful suggestions, an edit:

Uncorrupted consciousness is the natural state of duality. Everyone knows or has known this state. However, distractions move attention away from this simplicity, just as troubles cause one to look at the ground and not the sky.

Uncorrupted consciousness connects awareness to a clear perception of what’s happening. This is because the corruption that obscured clear perception leaves. The clear sky is not added to what is. Clouds that block the clear sky disappear to reveal sky, just as corruption of consciousness disappears to reveal clarity.

For example, PTSD that obscures clarity can be lost, uncluttering access to clear apprehension of the moment.

Thank you for your dedicated efforts to solidify these important points.
User avatar
Bill Wiltrack
Posts: 5468
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:52 pm
Location: Cleveland, Ohio, USA
Contact:

Re: ~ EVOLVING INTO PURE CONSCIOUSNESS ~

Post by Bill Wiltrack »

.





............................................
More than welcomed...my dear evolving minion.







.
Post Reply