What's the simplest form of life?

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Philosophy Explorer
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What's the simplest form of life?

Post by Philosophy Explorer »

I don't mean the simplest form discovered. I mean the simplest form period where it's impossible to have a simpler form of life which is proven by science.

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Harbal
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Re: What's the simplest form of life?

Post by Harbal »

Philosophy Explorer wrote: Wed Jul 05, 2017 9:07 am I don't mean the simplest form discovered. I mean the simplest form period where it's impossible to have a simpler form of life which is proven by science.
So you don't just mean the simplest form on this forum?
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Re: What's the simplest form of life?

Post by Greta »

It is a synthetic life from created by Craig Venter: https://www.sciencealert.com/this-machi ... re-reeling
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Re: What's the simplest form of life?

Post by Philosophy Explorer »

Greta wrote: Wed Jul 05, 2017 12:50 pm It is a synthetic life from created by Craig Venter: https://www.sciencealert.com/this-machi ... re-reeling
There's a catch to this:

"In 2016, Venter's team managed to produce a species of bacteria in the lab with just 437 genes - the absolute minimum of genetic code needed to support life (as far we know)."

"As far we know" isn't proven.

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Re: What's the simplest form of life?

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Harbal wrote: Wed Jul 05, 2017 12:32 pm
Philosophy Explorer wrote: Wed Jul 05, 2017 9:07 am I don't mean the simplest form discovered. I mean the simplest form period where it's impossible to have a simpler form of life which is proven by science.
So you don't just mean the simplest form on this forum?
It's debatable Harb.

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Re: What's the simplest form of life?

Post by wtf »

Philosophy Explorer wrote: Wed Jul 05, 2017 9:07 am I don't mean the simplest form discovered. I mean the simplest form period where it's impossible to have a simpler form of life which is proven by science.

What's your definition of life? Without any specific def, why isn't Conway's game of life the answer to your question?
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Re: What's the simplest form of life?

Post by attofishpi »

Philosophy Explorer wrote: Wed Jul 05, 2017 9:07 am I don't mean the simplest form discovered. I mean the simplest form period where it's impossible to have a simpler form of life which is proven by science.

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Re: What's the simplest form of life?

Post by Noax »

wtf wrote: Wed Jul 05, 2017 8:57 pm What's your definition of life? Without any specific def, why isn't Conway's game of life the answer to your question?
How might you define life then that you offer that. Conway's game of life is not life any more than Milton Bradley's game of life is, it is just different physics. Has anybody found a lifeform in it? A Turing machine, yes, but that by itself is not life.
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Re: What's the simplest form of life?

Post by wtf »

Noax wrote: Thu Jul 06, 2017 12:11 pm
wtf wrote: Wed Jul 05, 2017 8:57 pm What's your definition of life? Without any specific def, why isn't Conway's game of life the answer to your question?
How might you define life then that you offer that. Conway's game of life is not life any more than Milton Bradley's game of life is, it is just different physics. Has anybody found a lifeform in it? A Turing machine, yes, but that by itself is not life.
Wasn't that my question? One needs to define life before proposing a candidate for the simplest form of life. And the definition of life is not 100% clear, even in biology. There are things like viruses that are in a gray area.

Surely in a world where people speculate that we ourselves are computer programs that may be running in some large computer in the sky, or that we might in the future upload our minds to a computer, it's not unreasonable to challenge the OP with the example of Conway's Life. One need not believe in simulation and uploading (I don't) to be aware that these ideas have a certain trendiness these days.
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Re: What's the simplest form of life?

Post by Philosophy Explorer »

wtf wrote: Mon Jul 10, 2017 2:39 am
Noax wrote: Thu Jul 06, 2017 12:11 pm
wtf wrote: Wed Jul 05, 2017 8:57 pm What's your definition of life? Without any specific def, why isn't Conway's game of life the answer to your question?
How might you define life then that you offer that. Conway's game of life is not life any more than Milton Bradley's game of life is, it is just different physics. Has anybody found a lifeform in it? A Turing machine, yes, but that by itself is not life.
Wasn't that my question? One needs to define life before proposing a candidate for the simplest form of life. And the definition of life is not 100% clear, even in biology. There are things like viruses that are in a gray area.

Surely in a world where people speculate that we ourselves are computer programs that may be running in some large computer in the sky, or that we might in the future upload our minds to a computer, it's not unreasonable to challenge the OP with the example of Conway's Life. One need not believe in simulation and uploading (I don't) to be aware that these ideas have a certain trendiness these days.
If one needs to define life before proceeding to the title question, one can offer a tentative definition to move on. Otherwise you're suggesting you have no answer here. You have a choice.

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Last edited by Philosophy Explorer on Mon Jul 10, 2017 9:04 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: What's the simplest form of life?

Post by Walker »

Harbal wrote: Wed Jul 05, 2017 12:32 pm
Philosophy Explorer wrote: Wed Jul 05, 2017 9:07 am I don't mean the simplest form discovered. I mean the simplest form period where it's impossible to have a simpler form of life which is proven by science.
So you don't just mean the simplest form on this forum?
Quoting for the picture. Find what’s lively and you’ll find life. To be lively means to move, mind or body, and in fact life moves if only internally in biological processes, which is not to say that all that moves is alive, although in a sense we could say that. From this we can conclude that the simplest life is a big toe, toe-tappin.
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