I am an Islamophobe. If you are not, you might not be a moral person.

Is there a God? If so, what is She like?

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Greatest I am
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Re: I am an Islamophobe. If you are not, you might not be a moral person.

Post by Greatest I am »

surreptitious57 wrote: Thu Jun 08, 2017 9:07 pm
Greatest I am wrote:
surreptitious57 wrote:
You are still equating popularity with objectivity. They are not the same. Something that is popular may
be objective but that is purely coincidental. As it is also possible for something that is popular not to be
objective. And in the case of morality this is always true. And so regardless of how popular it actually is
I do not get much of whatever you are trying to say

Give me a scenario or example of what you describe as popular may
be objective as I know of no objective moral tenant except the one we are discussing here
I cannot give an example of an objective moral fact because none exist but objective facts do and that is
what I was referring to. The objectivity of a fact is not dependent upon how popular [ or unpopular ] it is
That is why you lost me. I was thinking morals. Not matter.

I agree with your last.

This song comes to mind. Enjoy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W8CibAuvZM4

Regards
DL
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Greatest I am
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Re: I am an Islamophobe. If you are not, you might not be a moral person.

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Belinda wrote: Thu Jun 08, 2017 9:17 pm Greatest I Am wrote;
Kill the roots, and the tree dis on it's own without costing the West any lives.
Can you suggest how to prevent superstition?
Yes.

Education and our governments repealing the Noble Lie they have been feeding us that the immoral mainstream idol worshiping religions deserve respect and tax breaks that you and I pay for in their stead.

Truth may be hard to take but just look at the 5,000 years of war that we have enjoyed thanks to the Noble Lie our governments maintain.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WvBxFXQy7-M

We must return to the past and their more intelligent thinking of the Gods.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WvBxFXQy7-M

How to initiate all that in a world where no one voice can be respected, heard and headed. I don't know.

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DL
Belinda
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Re: I am an Islamophobe. If you are not, you might not be a moral person.

Post by Belinda »

Greatest I Am wrote:
Education and our governments repealing the Noble Lie they have been feeding us that the immoral mainstream idol worshiping religions deserve respect and tax breaks that you and I pay for in their stead.
I agree , and so do a lot of other people. Can you suggest why the governments of the USA, and of Britain, are so attached to religions?

Obviously religion is excellent for theocracies, but democracies??

Maybe the governments of our democracies reckon that the hoi polloi cannot be socialised and controlled without religion.
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Greatest I am
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Re: I am an Islamophobe. If you are not, you might not be a moral person.

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Belinda wrote: Thu Jun 08, 2017 9:41 pm Greatest I Am wrote:
Education and our governments repealing the Noble Lie they have been feeding us that the immoral mainstream idol worshiping religions deserve respect and tax breaks that you and I pay for in their stead.
I agree , and so do a lot of other people. Can you suggest why the governments of the USA, and of Britain, are so attached to religions?

Obviously religion is excellent for theocracies, but democracies??

Maybe the governments of our democracies reckon that the hoi polloi cannot be socialised and controlled without religion.
The more fractured or split a society is, the more insecure it is and an insecure people/sheeple are easier for our oligarch owners to manipulate and control than a well informed bunch of free thinkers who are not prone to believe lies. Theists are conditioned to believe lies because they are prone to believe their priests, preachers and imams who lie to them on a constant basis about Gods that they cannot possibly know.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-14SllPPLxY

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DL
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Greatest I am
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Re: I am an Islamophobe. If you are not, you might not be a moral person.

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Belinda wrote: Thu Jun 08, 2017 9:41 pm Maybe the governments of our democracies reckon that the hoi polloi cannot be socialised and controlled without religion.
Both Christianity and Islam have basically developed into intolerant, homophobic and misogynous religions. Both religions have grown themselves by the sword instead of good deeds.

Jesus said we would know his people by their works and deeds. That means Jesus would not recognize Christians and Muslims as his people, and neither do I.

Is adherence to those immoral creeds a good way to socialise anyone?

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DL
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Seleucus
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Re: I am an Islamophobe. If you are not, you might not be a moral person.

Post by Seleucus »

Greatest I am wrote: Thu Jun 08, 2017 8:01 pm
Seleucus wrote: Thu Jun 08, 2017 5:21 pm [
Many suggestions but would persuasion via dialog and debates of their ideology not prove more worthy?

Is it not better to go to the root of the problem, their ideology and have Muslims themselves alter or adjust it, than to kill the leaves on the tree?

Kill the roots, and the tree dis on it's own without costing the West any lives.

Better a war of ideas than a war of bodies.

Regards
DL
Thanks for your reply. In line with what I've read in my study of counseling I'd like to move away from interpretation and towards action.

I'd suggest points 16, 15, 14, 12, 10, 9, 8, 7, 6, 5, 4, 3, and 2 are aimed at meeting the ideology.

The list is not difinitive, I'm open to additional ideas for course of action that would confront Islamic ideology.

Let us start an online philosophy discussion group in Arabic. A brief survey on google suggests there isn't even one...

"1. Extradition of all returning jihadists to death penalty countries for trial and execution.

2. Life sentence for all material assistance and incitement to terrorists.

3. Internment and deradicalization for all supporters and associates of terrorists.

4. Ban Muslim immigration which is not nuclear family only, student or high tech worker. Extreme vetting.

5. Repatriation or off-shore refugee detention for all Muslim refugees.

6. Significantly increase monitoring and investigations.

7. Discontinuation of all Sharia family courts.

8. Review all grants to Muslim organizations.

9. Vet applications for mosques and Islamic centers.

10. Segregated prisons for radical Muslims.

11. Escalation of drone projects.

12. More boots on the ground.

13. Expanded air missions.

14. Permanent military, naval and airbases in Muslim countries.

15. Establishments of USAID education projects, American schools and universities in all Muslim counties.

16. Philosophy Now online in Arabic."
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vegetariantaxidermy
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Re: I am an Islamophobe. If you are not, you might not be a moral person.

Post by vegetariantaxidermy »

Yep. Keep blowing them and their countries up because that makes muslims a lot less radical. Heck, there are only a couple of billion of them, in practically every country. I would love to know how blowing up a country like Syria reduces the chance of a muslim born and living in Sweden from becoming a 'terrorist'. Are you going to send drones to bomb Sweden? Or England? Or Germany? Or France? Or Australia?
'Rashid'. Is that Arabic for 'troll'? The depressing thing is that you probably aren't a troll. Plenty of people 'think' this way (which actually doesn't involve any thinking at all).
Last edited by vegetariantaxidermy on Sun Jun 11, 2017 3:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Greatest I am
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Re: I am an Islamophobe. If you are not, you might not be a moral person.

Post by Greatest I am »

Seleucus wrote: Fri Jun 09, 2017 2:59 am
Greatest I am wrote: Thu Jun 08, 2017 8:01 pm
Seleucus wrote: Thu Jun 08, 2017 5:21 pm [
Many suggestions but would persuasion via dialog and debates of their ideology not prove more worthy?

Is it not better to go to the root of the problem, their ideology and have Muslims themselves alter or adjust it, than to kill the leaves on the tree?

Kill the roots, and the tree dis on it's own without costing the West any lives.

Better a war of ideas than a war of bodies.

Regards
DL
Thanks for your reply. In line with what I've read in my study of counseling I'd like to move away from interpretation and towards action.

I'd suggest points 16, 15, 14, 12, 10, 9, 8, 7, 6, 5, 4, 3, and 2 are aimed at meeting the ideology.

The list is not difinitive, I'm open to additional ideas for course of action that would confront Islamic ideology.

Let us start an online philosophy discussion group in Arabic. A brief survey on google suggests there isn't even one...
You have nothing that would do the right thing I terms of judgements of the Muslim ideology.

The West is reluctant to fight the Muslim ideology because they fear that then Islam would demand that all religious ideologies be put on the same footing and judgement. They would be well justified in making that demand and the West, to be just, would have to comply.

Both Christianity and Islam are cut from the same ideological cloth of embracing slavery and it is hypocritical of us to embrace one immoral ideology while fighting against it's near mirror image.

The West would have to stop being hypocritical to open a judgement of Islam at the official level.

The West is not ready and the other violent steps you offer are ineffective against insurgency.

Regards
DL
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Re: I am an Islamophobe. If you are not, you might not be a moral person.

Post by Greatest I am »

The Noble Lie of freedom of religion must be repealed and freedom from religion must become the new catch phrase.

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DL
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Arising_uk
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Re: I am an Islamophobe. If you are not, you might not be a moral person.

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Seleucus wrote:1. Extradition of all returning jihadists to death penalty countries for trial and execution. ...
Doesn't sound much of a trial?

Should we have done this with the Spanish Brigades?
2. Life sentence for all material assistance and incitement to terrorists. ...
So we should have given life-sentences to those Irish who used to pass around the collection cups?
3. Internment and deradicalization for all supporters and associates of terrorists. ...
So to teach the values of democracy and freedom you'll incarcerate people?
4. Ban Muslim immigration which is not nuclear family only, student or high tech worker. Extreme vetting.
So on more helping refugees from war, leave the women and children to die eh!
5. Repatriation or off-shore refugee detention for all Muslim refugees.
Does it ever cross your mind that you and yours may one day be refugees?
6. Significantly increase monitoring and investigations.
How do you know how much is going on already?
7. Discontinuation of all Sharia family courts.
How on earth are you going to do this or do you mean in these Muslim countries that you're going to invade?
8. Review all grants to Muslim organizations.
Review all grants to any religious organisation.
9. Vet applications for mosques and Islamic centers.
Not sure where you're talking about but over here it looks like most of the mosques and centres are addressing this. You appear to ignore that anywhere can be a mosque or centre and the radical imam can just preach there unknown to anyone.
10. Segregated prisons for radical Muslims.
Thereby allowing them to really get organised and trained.
11. Escalation of drone projects.
You seriously think they aren't using all the drones they've got?
12. More boots on the ground.
Would that include you and yours?
13. Expanded air missions.
In what sense? As we are bombing the shit out of everything that moves.
14. Permanent military, naval and airbases in Muslim countries.
What do you think the war in Iraq was in part about? In case you've missed it the yank has this in many Muslim countries already.
15. Establishments of USAID education projects, American schools and universities in all Muslim counties.
Doesn't appear to do Americans much good and I seriously doubt they'll put up with others getting a free education when they themselves don't. How about just schools and universities from anywhere around the world, swedes and finns appear to do a good job with their populaces.
16. Philosophy Now online in Arabic.
You subscribe to the mag? As who will pay for this.
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Immanuel Can
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Re: I am an Islamophobe. If you are not, you might not be a moral person.

Post by Immanuel Can »

Greatest I am wrote: Fri Jun 09, 2017 2:36 pm The Noble Lie of freedom of religion must be repealed and freedom from religion must become the new catch phrase.

Regards
DL
I'd be curious to know if all the Atheists around are happy to agree with you, that there is a god inside each of them.

I'm just going to put that out there, and see what we get.
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Greatest I am
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Re: I am an Islamophobe. If you are not, you might not be a moral person.

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Immanuel Can wrote: Sat Jun 10, 2017 3:12 am
Greatest I am wrote: Fri Jun 09, 2017 2:36 pm The Noble Lie of freedom of religion must be repealed and freedom from religion must become the new catch phrase.

Regards
DL
I'd be curious to know if all the Atheists around are happy to agree with you, that there is a god inside each of them.

I'm just going to put that out there, and see what we get.
If atheists are free thinkers, which most I think are, then looking for God within themselves, God described as the best rules and laws to live by, should not be a problem. After all, if atheists do not follow their own better moral judgements than most of the idol worshiping religions, then they would not be free thinkers.

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DL
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Re: I am an Islamophobe. If you are not, you might not be a moral person.

Post by Greatest I am »

Philosophy Explorer wrote: Sat Jun 10, 2017 9:38 am Just caught this article:

http://www.apnewsarchive.com/2017/March ... a421194af7

PhilX
From that link.

"but scholars and others say the protesters are stoking unfounded fears and promoting a distorted and prejudiced view of the religion."

I see "unfounded fears" as a lie because we all free nations should having open Islamic slavery in our free countries.

That really stupid view, --- that it is an unfounded fear, --- is free men forgetting their first duty to all people of trying to insure that all people are free from slavery and a religion that wishes to kill all non-believers.

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DL
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Immanuel Can
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Re: I am an Islamophobe. If you are not, you might not be a moral person.

Post by Immanuel Can »

Greatest I am wrote: Sat Jun 10, 2017 8:46 pm If Atheists are free thinkers, which most I think are, then looking for God within themselves, God described as the best rules and laws to live by, should not be a problem.
And yet, I don't see them roaring in to sign on. I hear dead silence.

I'm not sure they want you as much as you want them.
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