If God is so merciful, then why did Jesus have to be sacrificed?

Is there a God? If so, what is She like?

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Belinda
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Re: If God is so merciful, then why did Jesus have to be sacrificed?

Post by Belinda »

Walker wrote:
Keats is saying that beauty is a timeless concept, or principle, that exists every moment, even though people come and go. Same with truth.

Question: how is it that concept and physical form “tease us out of thought.”
What that means for me is that beauty is mediated by poetic language, music, the plastic arts, and nature. The Grecian urn is an example of the plastic arts . The Grecian urn is also an example of slow time. Slow time, for instance an object retrieved in an archaeological dig of an ancient site, points to eternity by means of analogy, and the |Grecian urn has this attribute besides its beauty of form.

Fascination with slow time is one of the justifications for learning the history of man's past. If you contrast eternity with the transience which is out sad lot you can get a notion of what eternity is, and the Grecian urn gives the lie to transience, just for a brief spell of feeling instead of manipulating thoughts.

In answer to Harbal, the Grecian urn may be boring or even ugly for someone who has not learned the idiom.
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Harbal
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Re: If God is so merciful, then why did Jesus have to be sacrificed?

Post by Harbal »

thedoc wrote: IC, I hope you are enjoying your Easter,
I'm sure IC, of all people, is fully engrossed in the celebration of Christ's crucifixion.
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Arising_uk
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Re: If God is so merciful, then why did Jesus have to be sacrificed?

Post by Arising_uk »

Immanuel Can wrote:... On the one hand, they want to say that all Atheism means is "a disbelief in gods." ...
Once more for the hard of thought or the deliberately duplicitous, it's the not holding of a belief in a 'God'. I don't go around holding a 'disbelief in god's', I don't think about 'them' at all.
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Harbal
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Re: If God is so merciful, then why did Jesus have to be sacrificed?

Post by Harbal »

Belinda wrote: In answer to Harbal, the Grecian urn may be boring or even ugly for someone who has not learned the idiom.
Belinda, please don't take anything I say to Walker as being meant for general consumption. As far as the idiom is concerned: no, I haven't read anything by Homer.
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Arising_uk
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Re: If God is so merciful, then why did Jesus have to be sacrificed?

Post by Arising_uk »

Harbal wrote:I'm sure IC, of all people, is fully engrossed in the celebration of Christ's crucifixion.
Funny how Easter moves. Is that 'God' moving in a mysterious way or is it more likely that it's to do with the Christians appropriating a pagan festival of spring or even that it's just the Jewish Passover blurred by the Church and piety.
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Arising_uk
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Re: If God is so merciful, then why did Jesus have to be sacrificed?

Post by Arising_uk »

“What’s a Grecian urn?"

“Oh, about $25 a week unless he owns the restaurant.”

An American joke of all things.
Goke
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Re: If God is so merciful, then why did Jesus have to be sacrificed?

Post by Goke »

Truly there should be a better way but, it was read in the scriptures that when God was contemplating over who will be sent/sacrificed. Jesus offered himself.
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Immanuel Can
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Re: If God is so merciful, then why did Jesus have to be sacrificed?

Post by Immanuel Can »

thedoc wrote:IC, I hope you are enjoying your Easter, our grandchildren are with their parents but the whole family is coming over this evening for supper. My wife is in the middle of a cleaning frenzy, everything has to be clean and perfect for someone to come. Our daughters said they could always tell when we were getting company, my wife and I would be cleaning the house.
Yes, thank you. Mine sounds considerably more quiet than yours...just a good old friend from out of town visiting...still, a good weekend.

Every happiness to you.
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vegetariantaxidermy
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Re: If God is so merciful, then why did Jesus have to be sacrificed?

Post by vegetariantaxidermy »

Harbal wrote:
Walker wrote: The troll ration is sated for now and you should be commended for your rolls. While maintaining proper form while strolling through the fast food aisles of processed thought, a reiteration of the most important question from the work of young Keats is appropriate, although ponders be as scarce as worries for Alfred E.:
What, exactly, do you have against the English language, Walker. Why are you so intent on punishing it to the point of destruction?
:lol: I'm positive he has some program that specialises in gibberish (or it's 'copy paste' from some post-modern pseud).
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Greta
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Re: If God is so merciful, then why did Jesus have to be sacrificed?

Post by Greta »

Belinda wrote:Greta wrote:
How does Starry Night evoke eternity to you? I just see a multiple perspective like Picasso. Instead of taking different angles he seems to be taking different tempos of time. The picture suggests to me a snapshot with a lens in the middle showing with fast motion imagery of stars' apparent travel due to the world's rotation, like this:
... To photograph anything you need to do a lot of the work a painter does but what the camera work lacks compared with the paint is the directness of the hand work. The intellectual implication of eternity is the same though.
Greta, perhaps living as you do in spacious Oz you don't experience night -time light pollution which afflicts much of England. However do you think that night-time light pollution is positively bad for mental health? I do.
It's a bit like comparing the results of musicians or a music sequencer (as is used in most pop these days). I like the artisanship and subjectivism myself (although I personally consider hyper realism in art to be a mere technical display unless capturing more than can be captured by a camera rather than imitating one).

We have the same light pollution issues in cities here as everywhere. I don't mind because I most enjoy daytime skies and started what I hope to be quite a long term project, capturing sky's almost endless variety from one standpoint: https://goo.gl/photos/W7y1WfseQdqRBMwh9
Belinda wrote:At the risk of being accused of being a Christian
Please note the first photo in the above collection - an Easter-y cloud :)
Belinda wrote: ... and hopelessly unscientific I recommend that hymn, words by Addison, The Spacious Firmament on High and a good tune too, for expressing sheer feeling for the sky.

Similarly Psalm 19 of David The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament sheweth his handywork. David was a great poet. Unfortunately the religious, including presumably the poet himself, have used the feeling of wonder of nature to prove by argument from design that God did it.However I believe that, like the pictures, the poetry also expresses a quite common feeling of eternity and how we often need a vision of it, typically in the night sky. The expressive function of religion is not usually debated by philosophers.
You are not unscientific; more a romantic whose romance is bounded by sanity, judgement and realism.

Theists should ideally be able to appreciate natural wonders as much as anyone, although "God dunnit" is one of many filters (along with "what kind of x is that?" and "Is it dangerous?") that can inhibit deep understanding.
Belinda
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Re: If God is so merciful, then why did Jesus have to be sacrificed?

Post by Belinda »

I enjoyed the cloud photos, Greta.I understand that there are new categories of cloud taxonomy. My favourite clouds are lenticular clouds dolphins in the sky. This post belongs in the one about artificial intelligence but may I just say that despite the use of camera and internet the human is obvious in the initiative to photograph the things and the idea at all.
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Greta
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Re: If God is so merciful, then why did Jesus have to be sacrificed?

Post by Greta »

Belinda wrote:I enjoyed the cloud photos, Greta.I understand that there are new categories of cloud taxonomy. My favourite clouds are lenticular clouds dolphins in the sky. This post belongs in the one about artificial intelligence but may I just say that despite the use of camera and internet the human is obvious in the initiative to photograph the things and the idea at all.
Glad you enjoyed them, Belinda. When humans get me down, the sky helps me to put things into perspective. Yes, the lenticular clouds are quite surreal, one of those things that looks intelligently designed that just happens for fall into an unusually orderly form.

You are right, there's much that is human about the collection, even if the product of a pressed button with no post-production - the angles and timing are the result of human interest, opportunities, choices and mistakes. My interest was capturing variety, both in the moment and in sequence whereas an AI would snap the shots daily at specific times of day with exactly the same framing and, if the shots seemed repetitive and if the rainbows, golden sunsets and pink dawns were not captured, no matter.

A smart AI would capture every minute of every day with millions of photos and post with a directive of selecting for variety, colour, form etc and maybe pre-selected algorithms suggestive of what we'd perceive as beautiful.
Belinda
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Re: If God is so merciful, then why did Jesus have to be sacrificed?

Post by Belinda »

Harbal wrote:
Belinda, please don't take anything I say to Walker as being meant for general consumption. As far as the idiom is concerned: no, I haven't read anything by Homer.
I did not know that was the sort of thing Homer writes about. I intend to read some Homer. I know that Keats liked Homer's realms of gold and your recommendation spurs me on.
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Harbal
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Re: If God is so merciful, then why did Jesus have to be sacrificed?

Post by Harbal »

Belinda wrote: your recommendation spurs me on.
Stop teasing, Belinda, I know you're far too smart to follow any recommendation of mine. :)
Belinda
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Re: If God is so merciful, then why did Jesus have to be sacrificed?

Post by Belinda »

Harbal wrote:
Stop teasing, Belinda, I know you're far too smart to follow any recommendation of mine. :)
Unwitting testimony is best
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