Philosophy Now Forum

:lol: You're not reading. My argument is that Subjectivism doesn't work at all, even on its own terms. And that's regardless of whether or not objective morality is even possible. But your argument was, once again, that subjectivism doesn't give us any information on objectivist terms. No, my argum...

Right. So was it moral or immoral? We can't say. Right. So was she moral or immoral? We can't say. You see? We have no moral information about either...and that's because of Subjectivism. It doesn't provide any moral insight. Therefore after 20k+ comments, your best argument seems to be that morali...

Well since people (or rather those 2-3 out of 10 people who do go against nature, which is too little on the long run) are also part of nature, and these "metaphysical insertions" are simply how these people think, it may be the case that this is still all part of, metaphorically speaking,...

Then if the "group" of Nazis says, "Jews must be exterminated," that's "moral"? :shock: Or even if a "person" does? :shock: And what if the "group" tells the "person" to kill Jews, and she refuses? Is she then "moral" (for sticki...

"Man contradicts Nature at every turn."
Like how?

I neither said that, nor even implied it. In fact, I said the opposite: that I don't need any reference to Objective Moralizing to make the point. Here's the point: what can Moral Subjectivism, even if we took it to be entirely true, teach anybody? It's about group morals, if a group agrees on them...

All that I've really said is that I've always elevated human thinking and myself to religious heights, mystified thinking and myself, even though we all know that there's absolutely no reason to. Now you reveal, I think, what you are really on about. Any position that someone takes that does not co...

Fine, you've chosen a religion. No, not quite. My perspectives came before I considered religion as such. All that I have really said is that there is a world of metaphysical impetus (idea, pattern, imposition) that comes through man and molds and determines his world. And I think there are (indeed...

Fine, you've chosen a religion.

No. The argument is that Moral Subjectivism fails to deliver any information at all. It fails on its own two legs, so to speak, and needs no input from Objectivism in order to fail. You mean it doesn't deliver any objective moral information at all. I neither said that, nor even implied it. In fact...

After 20k+ comments, his best argument seems to be that morality can't be subjective, because only objective morality can be morality. No. The argument is that Moral Subjectivism fails to deliver any information at all. It fails on its own two legs, so to speak, and needs no input from Objectivism ...

What if I take a brain scan of someone who is having abstract thoughts, and some brain regions light up on the scan?

Alexis Jacobi wrote: ↑Sat May 04, 2024 12:42 pm

Atla wrote: ↑Sat May 04, 2024 11:43 am People often come forward with their metaphysical attainments here, I do too sometimes.

What is a metaphysical attainment?

Attaining satori for example, but I don't really know how people use the word metaphysical, there seem to be different meanings in use.

Plato, Aristotle — mere children when I reflect on my own attainments. Could you present your (higher order metaphysical?) attainments? You could not possibly have taken me seriously …. Only half-seriously. People often come forward with their metaphysical attainments here, I do too sometimes. Thou...

I don't doubt that a lot of people do think of morality, or certain aspects of it, as something that corresponds to some sort of truth, but the topic is about what morality actually is, not what some people happen to believe it is. Well, we know what it isn't. It isn't "subjective." But t...